What teacher? (calling Twilight to Hell because she wanted me to)

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  • Doc TorDoc Tor Hell Host
    Doc Tor wrote: »
    That's a very Purgatorial question...

    *cough*
  • Lyda wrote: »
    Yup. I keep wondering when this hypothetical "greatness" was. I think there have been a number of things great about America and still are. But the country as a whole "great"? I dunno.

    The key is, it's been far more great for middle-class and rich white people than people of color. "Make America great again" is code for "Make America great for white people again." 45's actions and policies thus far bear this out.
  • finelinefineline Kerygmania Host
    @la vie en rouge I know it does - that's why I put the 'great' bit in quotation marks. It doesn't stop people using it to talk about how Britian used to be great though. I was saying the same discussion is had about the UK, and people use the 'great' in Great Britain to debate it's greatness and whether it was ever great.
  • Has America ever been great?
    Most Britons and many other Europeans certainly thought so after the United States bailed them out of two world wars and then supplied them with the means to rebuild. Most of the world thought so in the days of the (recently abandoned) Pax Americana. This is a country that took on a heavily disproportionate share of the costs of maintaining the United Nations and NATO, among other organizations. We would have had far fewer democracies without the encouragement of the United States.

    Unfortunately, the orange fascist now in the White House is busily tearing all that down. I hope things can change in time.

  • mousethief wrote: »
    . Her most famous absurdity that she doubled down on like a dog on a bone: "I didn't realize clothes came in sizes." She was in her late teens.

    Given the rather uncertain relationship between the number on the label and the dimensions of the person that the clothing fits, this one is almost understandable. :grin:
  • ExclamationMarkExclamationMark Shipmate
    edited February 26
    Rossweisse wrote: »
    Has America ever been great?
    Most Britons and many other Europeans certainly thought so after the United States bailed them out of two world wars and then supplied them with the means to rebuild. Most of the world thought so in the days of the (recently abandoned) Pax Americana. This is a country that took on a heavily disproportionate share of the costs of maintaining the United Nations and NATO, among other organizations. We would have had far fewer democracies without the encouragement of the United States.

    Unfortunately, the orange fascist now in the White House is busily tearing all that down. I hope things can change in time.

    Most Britons IME think exactly the opposite. The support was only there in WW2 post Pearl Harbour and lease lend meant just that - a loan that had to be repaid.

    Mind you my father used to say that he learned a lot as a child/teen from observing the (ahem) "antics" of US Airmen at the base in his village. Apparently you couldn't get into any air raid shelter without seeing …. well best left to the imagination. It was also instructive to watch the lorries and busloads of young women being shipped in. Yes the press made much of the "dances" (even Glenn Miller played there) but it was also "entertainment."

    The US has also been involved in a number of rather dubious attempts to prop up other countries, usually those with a very right government. They are hardly democracies in the sense of the word. It would also be helpful if every child in the US had to read Bury my heart at Wounded Knee to understand just what freedom and greatness really entails - not only the destruction of an ecosystem but genocide for many nations. The social conditions of native americans remains appalling and no one seems to care. There's also racism inherent in the financial crash in the 2008/9 era

    As far as Trump is concerned, to describe him as a fascist is a double insult: firstly to use the term at all and secondly to insult "fascists" by associating him with them. Poor guys: I wouldn't wish him on anyone.

    I know: one day I'll wake up and it will all have been a dream. Bobby will be back

  • ExclamationMark--

    Two separate things:

    --Bobby = RFK?

    I don't know if he would get to be president, if he would even want to be. He blamed himself for JFK's death. Ted's long-gone, too. So he wouldn't have any brotherly support. Don't remember if he has a sister left.

    --In context of your comments about the US:

    {Gentle cough.} Pssst...*empire*...
  • My late mother-in-law when discussing in less than complimentary terms some aspect of non-white middle class British culture used to remark wistfully " And to think we used to have an Empire......"
    Cue choking on my afternoon cup of tea!
  • Doc TorDoc Tor Hell Host
    Doc Tor wrote: »
    Doc Tor wrote: »
    That's a very Purgatorial question...

    *cough*

    By all that is Holy and Sacred, you lot simply cannot take a hint, let alone a pointed hint.

    I'm getting the clue bat out now. If you want to discuss "Great", take it Purgatory like I have suggested twice.

    And people wonder why I'm such a misanthrope.

    DT
    HH
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Rossweisse wrote: »
    Has America ever been great?
    Most Britons and many other Europeans certainly thought so after the United States bailed them out of two world wars and then supplied them with the means to rebuild. Most of the world thought so in the days of the (recently abandoned) Pax Americana. This is a country that took on a heavily disproportionate share of the costs of maintaining the United Nations and NATO, among other organizations. We would have had far fewer democracies without the encouragement of the United States.

    Unfortunately, the orange fascist now in the White House is busily tearing all that down. I hope things can change in time.

    Most Britons IME think exactly the opposite. The support was only there in WW2 post Pearl Harbour and lease lend meant just that - a loan that had to be repaid.

    Most here are grateful to the US in coming to our aid when Churchill was furious that the Aust PM wanted to bring the troops back to defend their country rather than some romantic idea of Indian Empire. And let's be honest - the outcome of both WW I and WW II were determined by US intervention regardless of the various antics you refer to.
  • Doc TorDoc Tor Hell Host
    Fucking hell can you people not read?
  • Golden Key wrote: »
    ExclamationMark--

    Two separate things:

    --Bobby = RFK?

    I don't know if he would get to be president, if he would even want to be. He blamed himself for JFK's death. Ted's long-gone, too. So he wouldn't have any brotherly support. Don't remember if he has a sister left.

    --In context of your comments about the US:

    {Gentle cough.} Pssst...*empire*...

    Bobby: Ewing - Dallas.
    Empire - we get slated for that all the time. Rightly so. I can't change the past but we're trying to change the future. From here it looks like the USA I embracing the worst of the past with gusto and is also failing to act to improve the conditions of those oppressed (e.g. Native Americans).
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