Proof Americans and Brits speak a different language

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  • mousethiefmousethief Shipmate
    Gramps49 wrote: »
    Did someone say limbo stick?

    Thanks, now I'm going to have that stupid song stuck in my head all evening.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    :smiley:
  • I've come across a Canadian phrase, which was something like, "taken to the doctor's" and means "cheated". I can't imagine a link between the two; can anyone elucidate?
  • SparrowSparrow Shipmate
    In the UK it would be "taken to the cleaners".

  • mousethiefmousethief Shipmate
    "Taken to the cleaners" is what we say here (PNW USA). Or "fleeced".
  • My mind is going. The phrase was something about dinner, rather than doctors.
  • George SpiggottGeorge Spiggott Shipmate Posts: 9
    When I visited Texas I got on ok for the most part. I did however forget where I was in sandwich shops and kept asking for tomato which lead to baffled looks until my host stepped in and explained that I meant to-may-to.

    To my ears both words don't sound that different but id have been left hungry if they hadn't stepped in.
  • I once asked multiple times for a new spoon in a restaurant, but I had been in Chicago just long enough to pick up the different way of pronouncing it, and the kid at the counter back in Seattle didn't understand it. Finally I exaggeratedly said spooooooooon, and he got it.
  • George SpiggottGeorge Spiggott Shipmate Posts: 9
    I'm reminded of this delightful anecdote.

    In 1964 English author Monica Dickens, the great-granddaughter of Charles Dickens, was visiting Australia to promote a book. During a signing session in Sydney, a woman presented her with one of her books and said “Emma Chisit”. Dickens dutifully wrote “To Emma Chisit” on the inside cover, signed her name. and handed it back. “Naw!” said the woman, “Emma chisit?” After several more rounds of this it dawned on Monica that the woman had asked, in an Australian accent, “How much is it?”
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    Can any stateside shipmate enlighten a poor ignorant Brit about the expression 'slam dunk'? I assume it has no connection with doughnuts?
  • Eirenist wrote: »
    Can any stateside shipmate enlighten a poor ignorant Brit about the expression 'slam dunk'? I assume it has no connection with doughnuts?
    No, it's related to basketball. A slam dunk is when a player jumps right at the basket and forcefully dunks the ball through the net. See here.

    Colloquially, a "slam dunk" means a "sure thing."

  • I did know that, but I love the idea of aggressive donut dunking!
  • I did know that, but I love the idea of aggressive donut dunking!

    That's because you don't have to wipe up the counter.
  • cgichardcgichard Shipmate
    mousethief wrote: »
    I once asked multiple times for a new spoon in a restaurant, but I had been in Chicago just long enough to pick up the different way of pronouncing it, and the kid at the counter back in Seattle didn't understand it. Finally I exaggeratedly said spooooooooon, and he got it.

    My Australian step-daughter did something similar on her first vist to London: she asked for a "spun". Also "marone" for the colour maroon.
  • CathscatsCathscats Shipmate
    I once tried very hard in Chicago to get some Cranberry juice at a restaurant. What the server hear was not cranberry juice, but "cran bridges"!
  • orfeoorfeo Shipmate
    How do people pronounce the word "apricot"?

    I've just been struck by an American (not sure what region) pronouncing it with a really short "a". Whereas I use a longer "ay" sound.
  • EnochEnoch Shipmate
    UK normal = ay-pri (short i)-cot.
  • Have we discussed Zed or Zee already? Zed is in Shakespeare, so where does Zee come from?
  • orfeoorfeo Shipmate
    Have we discussed Zed or Zee already? Zed is in Shakespeare, so where does Zee come from?

    First attested to in the 1670s, apparently. Possibly to be more consistent with bee, cee, dee etc.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Aypreecot is a bit more more common here than aypricot (with the short i) but not much in it.
  • I've heard apricot with the short 'a', and I think it must have been in the UK, because it was a long time ago (and I'm not sure I've ever discussed that particular fruit with an American.) But I'd certainly think it an unusual pronunciation.
  • Short A for apricot and avocado. Ay-pricot and Aw-vocado sound odd to me. Similarly pasta has a short A: compare paw-sta.

    Marzipan is another. Martz-i-pan for me. I hear Mars-i-pan.
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    Of course the French 'abricot' has a short 'a', so that is probably strictly correct. But 'aypricot' is in my experience universal in the UK. Can't have those Frogs telling us how to speak our own language, can we?
  • Reported to Styx.
  • jedijudyjedijudy Heaven Host, 8th Day Host
    Rolling of Hostly eyes
    @Eirenist: Please remember which board you are on. We don't countenance disparaging names for citizens of other countries, even if used in jest.
    Looking across the road to see where the Hostly eyes have rolled off to.

    Also, @NOprophet_NØprofit your post wasn't particularly Heavenly, either. I'm giving you grace in sympathy with your present grief.

    jedijudy
    Heaven Host
  • Gill HGill H Shipmate
    Apes eat apricots (well, they may not, but they sound like them here in the UK).

    I first heard the short ‘a’ version in ‘You’re So Vain’ so evidently it is a US pronunciation, or at least in Carly Simon’s neck of the woods.

    Talking of pronunciation in songs, Faith Hill’s ‘This Kiss’ talks about ‘cen-TRIF-u-gal motion’ whereas I would say ‘centri-FEW-gal’.



  • EnochEnoch Shipmate
    Marzipan is normally 'mars-i-pan' here. A 'tz' sound would be odd.
  • And what about "solicitor"? I've only known it as a type of lawyer, but in the American novel I am currently reading it seems to refer to a door to door salesman.
  • orfeo wrote: »
    Have we discussed Zed or Zee already? Zed is in Shakespeare, so where does Zee come from?

    First attested to in the 1670s, apparently. Possibly to be more consistent with bee, cee, dee etc.

    Attested to in Britain?
  • mousethiefmousethief Shipmate
    edited August 25
    First syllable of apricot (which takes the accent) has the æ vowel sound of app, sap, clap, rap, trap, map, zap. Here in the PNW of the USA.
  • mousethief wrote: »
    First syllable of apricot (which takes the accent) has the æ vowel sound of app, sap, clap, rap, trap, map, zap. Here in the PNW of the USA.
    It’s more often “ape-ri-cot” in my corner of the American South, but one hears it with the æ sound as well.

    Meanwhile, the accent in “centrifugal” is on the second syllable, and for “marzipan,” one usually hears “mar-tzi-pan,” but sometimes “mar-zi-pan.”

  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    In North America solicitor can be used to refer to someone who is taking orders for a business or someone who legally represents a client in a court.

    Do you know the difference between a lawyer and a solicitor? A lawyer is legally qualified to give legal advice, but not necessarily represent a person in court. A solicitor can give legal advice and represent a person in court.
  • Gramps49 wrote: »
    In North America solicitor can be used to refer to someone who is taking orders for a business or someone who legally represents a client in a court.

    Do you know the difference between a lawyer and a solicitor? A lawyer is legally qualified to give legal advice, but not necessarily represent a person in court. A solicitor can give legal advice and represent a person in court.
    This may be one of those things that varies from state to state. In a legal context here (North Carolina), “solicitor” was historically mainly limited to reference to a prosecutor—specifically what we’ve called the District Attorney since the 1960s used to be the Solicitor or State Solicitor.

    The only context in which I ever hear “solicitor” used in an American legal context is in the title “Solicitor General.” I’ve never heard a lawyer in private practice referred to as a “solicitor.”

  • MarsupialMarsupial Shipmate
    We have a unified bar here in Canada - everyone is both a barrister and a solicitor - but in informal usage barristers litigate and advise on matters likely to lead to litigation, whereas solicitors do transactional work (corporate stuff, wills and estates, etc.).
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Marsupial wrote: »
    We have a unified bar here in Canada - everyone is both a barrister and a solicitor - but in informal usage barristers litigate and advise on matters likely to lead to litigation, whereas solicitors do transactional work (corporate stuff, wills and estates, etc.).

    By and large the position in my State, and in Victoria. There are different professional associations for each branch. I am not sure about the smaller states.

    The Attorneys-General are all politicians, with no requirement that they be a lawyer. The Solicitor-General for the Commonwealth, NSW and Victoria is, in each jurisdiction, the second law officer of the Crown. Despite the title, each is a barrister (in fact an eminent barrister), and appears for the government in the most substantial non-criminal cases.
  • First definition for "solicitor" I ever learned was "call girl".
  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host, 8th Day Host
    edited August 25
    In England and Wales a solicitor is a lawyer who (broadly speaking) deals directly with lay clients, giving advice and acting on their behalf. A barrister is a lawyer who (broadly speaking) deals with lay clients through a solicitor and gives specialist advice and/or acts as their advocate in court. It used to be (maybe still is) the convention that a barrister wouldn’t see a client without a solicitor (or solicitor’s clerk) present.

    AFAICT the word attorney in the English legal system is only used for the Attorney General, or in the generic sense of someone appointed to act for another under a power if attorney.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    mousethief wrote: »
    First definition for "solicitor" I ever learned was "call girl".

    A very old joke, perhaps even older than ?
  • la vie en rougela vie en rouge Circus Host, 8th Day Host
    For the sweet almond confection, I quite like Shakespeare's word "marchpane". I forget which play.
  • Back in the day, when I was a solicitor, a married couple of American Mormons rented a house a couple of doors down; they were in Scotland for a year on church business. They were perfectly polite saying, Good morning" etc when we passed.

    A few weeks in they came up to me and apologised for being unfriendly and for not having stopped to chat to me. "We were told you were a solicitor" they explained "and we had completely the wrong idea about you!"

    They saw me going to and from work at 8.30 am and 5.30pm, wearing a suit and carrying a briefcase. I've always wondered what they thought was in that briefcase!

    The said that they had also misjudged someone who told them he couldn't stop to speak because he was on his way to the chippy. Apparently they thought a "chippy" was a brothel, and were relieved to discover it was a restaurant which sold fish and chips.
  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host, 8th Day Host
    Makes you wonder what sort of place they thought they’d come to!

    Maybe they’d had advice like Gerard Hoffnung’s advice for tourists in London (begins at about 5'15")
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    BroJames wrote: »
    In England and Wales a solicitor is a lawyer who (broadly speaking) deals directly with lay clients, giving advice and acting on their behalf. A barrister is a lawyer who (broadly speaking) deals with lay clients through a solicitor and gives specialist advice and/or acts as their advocate in court. It used to be (maybe still is) the convention that a barrister wouldn’t see a client without a solicitor (or solicitor’s clerk) present.

    AFAICT the word attorney in the English legal system is only used for the Attorney General, or in the generic sense of someone appointed to act for another under a power if attorney.

    I would never see the lay client without the solicitor present; after all, I was briefed by the solicitor.

    As to attorney: until the advent of the fused profession (a fusion which has never worked in practice), people would be admitted as "attorney, solicitor, and proctor"; strictly speaking, solicitor applied in Equity proceedings, attorney in Common Law; and proctor in Probate. Those days are now history.
  • BroJames wrote: »
    AFAICT the word attorney in the English legal system is only used for the Attorney General, or in the generic sense of someone appointed to act for another under a power if attorney.
    Here, the formal distinction is “attorney-at-law” for someone admitted to the bar, and “attorney-in-fact” for the sense of someone acting under a power of attorney. “Attorney” is assumed to mean attorney-at-law, and is interchangeable with lawyer.

    We also have a unified bar in the US. The distinctions suggested by the terms “solicitor” and “barrister” do not exist here, and with the few exceptions I noted above for “solicitor,” neither term is used. The only other term that might be used is “counsellor” (or “counsel,” which is how lawyers are generally addressed in court); my license states that I am licensed as “Attorney and Counsellor at Law.” (Yes, there are two lls in “Counsellor.”)

  • MarsupialMarsupial Shipmate
    Gee D wrote: »
    Marsupial wrote: »
    We have a unified bar here in Canada - everyone is both a barrister and a solicitor - but in informal usage barristers litigate and advise on matters likely to lead to litigation, whereas solicitors do transactional work (corporate stuff, wills and estates, etc.).

    The Attorneys-General are all politicians, with no requirement that they be a lawyer. The Solicitor-General for the Commonwealth, NSW and Victoria is, in each jurisdiction, the second law officer of the Crown. Despite the title, each is a barrister (in fact an eminent barrister), and appears for the government in the most substantial non-criminal cases.

    I used to think that the AG absolutely had to be a lawyer, until it was pointed out to me that a non-lawyer served in the position in Ontario as recently as the early 1990s. That strikes me as a very bad idea. It's very rare that an AG will appear personally in Court; I believe it's happened within recent memory, but I can't think of a specific case. Practically speaking, the Solicitor General position where it exists has to do with police and jails and the like; a number of governments have re-named the position to something more descriptive though the most recent government reverted back to "Solicitor General" from "Minister of Community Safety and Correctional Services." It's all a question of what they want on their letterhead...

    BroJames wrote: »
    In England and Wales a solicitor is a lawyer who (broadly speaking) deals directly with lay clients, giving advice and acting on their behalf. A barrister is a lawyer who (broadly speaking) deals with lay clients through a solicitor and gives specialist advice and/or acts as their advocate in court. It used to be (maybe still is) the convention that a barrister wouldn’t see a client without a solicitor (or solicitor’s clerk) present.

    Some high-end litigation firms here use the word "Barristers" in their firm name to emphasize that litigation is all they do. But practically speaking a lot of what they do is stuff that would probably be considered solicitor work in the UK. It doesn't happen the other way around. Generically, we tend to be uninventive and generically call people licensed to practice law lawyers, or in professional settings "counsel" (singular or plural, no article).

  • For the sweet almond confection, I quite like Shakespeare's word "marchpane". I forget which play.

    Romeo and Juliet, I,5:
    Away with the joint-stools, remove the
    court-cupboard, look to the plate. Good thou, save
    me a piece of marchpane; and, as thou lovest me, let
    the porter let in Susan Grindstone and Nell.
    Antony, and Potpan!

  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Marsupial wrote: »
    Gee D wrote: »
    Marsupial wrote: »
    We have a unified bar here in Canada - everyone is both a barrister and a solicitor - but in informal usage barristers litigate and advise on matters likely to lead to litigation, whereas solicitors do transactional work (corporate stuff, wills and estates, etc.).

    The Attorneys-General are all politicians, with no requirement that they be a lawyer. The Solicitor-General for the Commonwealth, NSW and Victoria is, in each jurisdiction, the second law officer of the Crown. Despite the title, each is a barrister (in fact an eminent barrister), and appears for the government in the most substantial non-criminal cases.

    I used to think that the AG absolutely had to be a lawyer, until it was pointed out to me that a non-lawyer served in the position in Ontario as recently as the early 1990s. That strikes me as a very bad idea. It's very rare that an AG will appear personally in Court; I believe it's happened within recent memory, but I can't think of a specific case. Practically speaking, the Solicitor General position where it exists has to do with police and jails and the like; a number of governments have re-named the position to something more descriptive though the most recent government reverted back to "Solicitor General" from "Minister of Community Safety and Correctional Services." It's all a question of what they want on their letterhead...

    I can't speak of other jurisdictions here, but can't remember the last time the NSW Attorney-General was not a lawyer, although many have been solicitors rather than barristers. It's just that there is no requirement that the A-G be a lawyer.

    The Solicitor-General would not be too concerned with police and gaols; they are separate government portfolios. The holder of that office would be appearing in the most important civil and constitutional cases. In any event, the Director of Public Prosecutions is the one concerned with the criminal side (for serious crimes), with ultimate responsibility for the work of the Solicitor for Public Prosecutions and those employed in that office, as well as for Crown Prosecutors, who are the barristers who appear in the superior criminal courts.
  • orfeoorfeo Shipmate
    orfeo wrote: »
    Have we discussed Zed or Zee already? Zed is in Shakespeare, so where does Zee come from?

    First attested to in the 1670s, apparently. Possibly to be more consistent with bee, cee, dee etc.

    Attested to in Britain?

    Yes.
  • Gee D wrote: »
    mousethief wrote: »
    First definition for "solicitor" I ever learned was "call girl".

    A very old joke, perhaps even older than ?

    I wasn't telling a joke I was making an observation.
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    Apologies for my lapse a few posts back. I haad forgotten where I was, having made too many visits to Hell.
  • jedijudyjedijudy Heaven Host, 8th Day Host
    Thank you, Eirenist!
    jj-HH
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