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Ship of Fools: St Cecilia Parish, Boston, Massachusetts, USA

The Mystery WorshipperThe Mystery Worshipper Shipmate
edited November 2021 in The Mystery Worshipper

imageShip of Fools: St Cecilia Parish, Boston, Massachusetts, USA

A creative approach to music – much to admire

Read the full Mystery Worshipper report here


Comments

  • boston_irishboston_irish Shipmate
    edited November 2021
    Good report. Saint C’s checks off all the boxes in a good way. If I lived closer this would definitely be my home parish. Yes, Fr [name retracted]’s Masses tend to…. erm go on for a bit. So if you find yourself in Boston and you’re looking for a ‘Golfer’s Special’ a Sunday morning Mass right at 30 minutes, try nearby St Francis Chapel at the Prudential Center. The OVM priests will have you in and out in a jiff.
  • boston_irishboston_irish Shipmate
    It’s OMV, sorry. Oblates of the Virgin Mary
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    OVM - Officious Virtuous Mothers?

    Back to the report. boston-irish, do you have any comment on the make-up of the congregation please? The MW describes it as "(a) diverse congregation in every way except race" by which I gather it is almost entirely white.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    Interpolationist - what a lovely word! I shall apply it immediately to Father-In-Charge at Our Place, as he has a similar habit of commenting, explaining etc., so that our Sunday service is at least twenty minutes longer than it need be...
  • boston_irishboston_irish Shipmate
    Re: Diversity. As I said this is not my home parish. But as I’ve noticed from visiting other churches in the area (TECUSA) the congregations are largely white with little or no diversity. The Back Bay and Beacon Hill areas of Boston could hardly be called diverse. They are as WASPy as you can get. The fact that there is a Catholic church in the area is remarkable in and of itself. Another thing, people who live in Boston proper walk to church or take the subway. They don’t drive, there’s no parking anyway. There are Catholic Churches in other parts of the city that reflect the makeup of the neighborhood. We still have many churches that are still all Italian, Portuguese, French, Irish, etc. We are slowly making progress in the diversity department. We just elected a woman of color as mayor. Baby steps.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Thanks - I was rather surprised at a Catholic church in the sort of Boston area you described.
  • alphabeatriumalphabeatrium Shipmate Posts: 4
    A Catholic church that affirms homosexual relationships? What does the bishop think of that?
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Probably nothing unless he is being harassed by the local Temple Police
  • alphabeatriumalphabeatrium Shipmate Posts: 4
    Sorry if I offend you, but I just don't understand the mentality. If you disagree with Catholic moral teaching, no one is keeping you there. I just really get uncomfrtable when people try to present Catholic Christianity as something it is not. It's dishonest, and in my view, leads people astray from the (yes, difficult) truth.
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Last comment before you and I get done for derailing the thread:

    I note a lot of selective thinking on the part of them as challenges the orthodoxy of their fellow-Christians, in particular with an undue preoccupation with other people’s sex lives.

    You’ve strayed into Dead Horse territory, you have.

    Now back to Mystery Worshipping….
  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth Shipmate
    Don't make Miss Amanda stamp her foot and close this thread. Get back on track now. She means it!

    @Amanda B Reckondwyth
    Lead Editor, Mystery Worship
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Thanks Miss Amanda good to know you’re awake
  • Box PewBox Pew Shipmate
    Really very few preachers indeed can sustain 22 minutes of decent sermon. And I dont believe any congregation should have to endure less than outstanding preaching that long. Why not stick to 8 minutes of clear exposition on the readings - especially when they are the End Time texts, as here. That way the congregation members are more likely to remember something of the preacher's words.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    The Reporter did note that the first 15 minutes of the sermon were the best! Presumably 8 minutes would not have been long enough for the priest to say what he felt led by the Spirit to say...
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Box Pew wrote: »
    Really very few preachers indeed can sustain 22 minutes of decent sermon. And I dont believe any congregation should have to endure less than outstanding preaching that long. Why not stick to 8 minutes of clear exposition on the readings - especially when they are the End Time texts, as here. That way the congregation members are more likely to remember something of the preacher's words.

    We'd allow 10 minutes - a bit of time at the start to say how they did (or did not) fit together and to explain any unfamiliar words/allusions. Then 8 minutes or so on the Gospel passage, what it says and what message and lesson can we take from it. Then a minute to wind up. A sermon should not be a display of Bibliology.
  • Nick TamenNick Tamen Shipmate
    Box Pew wrote: »
    Really very few preachers indeed can sustain 22 minutes of decent sermon. And I dont believe any congregation should have to endure less than outstanding preaching that long. Why not stick to 8 minutes of clear exposition on the readings - especially when they are the End Time texts, as here. That way the congregation members are more likely to remember something of the preacher's words.
    Here we go yet again with this recurring discussion on the Ship.

    This very much depends on the church tradition and what is expected of the sermon in various traditions, as well as expectations of the worshippers in a given community. Sermons of approximately 20 minutes are very much the norm in my tradition, and there are very many preachers who are quite capable of sustaining decent and often excellent sermons for that period of time.

  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth Shipmate
    Nick Tamen wrote: »
    Here we go yet again with this recurring discussion on the Ship.
    Which doesn't belong here. Take it to Ecclesiantics, please.

    @Amanda B Reckondwyth
    Lead Editor, Mystery Worship
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    Well, quite.

    Back to the MW Report, and what would turn me off this church far more than a long sermon (even if most of it was of good quality) is the priest's habit of *interpolating* his own bits into the liturgy.

    Such *interpolation* is An Abomination Before The Lord. We get it at Our Place, with several mini-sermons scattered throughout the service, making a wordy liturgy even wordier. And loooooooooooooonger...
    :grimace:
  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth Shipmate
    Now that I agree with completely! The Holy Spirit did not dictate the Roman Missal, or its derivatives, to faithful scribes only to have it toyed with.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    Preach it, Miss Amanda!

    (But not during Mass, if you please).
  • Alan29Alan29 Shipmate
    Amanda B Reckondwyth wrote: »
    Now that I agree with completely! The Holy Spirit did not dictate the Roman Missal, or its derivatives, to faithful scribes only to have it toyed with.

    Loving the irony.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    What irony?
    :wink:
  • Alan29Alan29 Shipmate
    Bishops Finger wrote: »
    What irony?
    :wink:

    I assume nobody actually believes the Holy Spirit dictated the Roman Missal, therefore it is a human construct and theirs to change.
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Traddy Triddies,maybe
  • venbedevenbede Shipmate
    O dear. The priest is no doubt a lovely, well intentioned man and I will sound like a pedantic grump for saying this, but here goes.

    At the greeting the priest and people recognise each other’s presence and so constitute the church in that place. That is why it is said before anything else, priest and people equally participating.

    To precede the greeting with lots of “Hello campers!” stuff reduces it to mere mumbo jumbo. It means a passive congregation is dependent on a didactic priest. The effect is clericalist and patronising, although I expect most people won’t notice and it is the opposite of what the priest intends with his efforts to be friendly.

    I’m sure he’s a lovely man.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    I could (and will) say much the same about Our Place's FatherInCharge.

    The Greeting is preceded by a mini-sermon and welcome, and followed by the first hymn, during which FInC (a lovely man, and a prayerful pastor) marches in for the second time...
    🙄
  • Alan29Alan29 Shipmate
    venbede wrote: »
    O dear. The priest is no doubt a lovely, well intentioned man and I will sound like a pedantic grump for saying this, but here goes.

    At the greeting the priest and people recognise each other’s presence and so constitute the church in that place. That is why it is said before anything else, priest and people equally participating.

    To precede the greeting with lots of “Hello campers!” stuff reduces it to mere mumbo jumbo. It means a passive congregation is dependent on a didactic priest. The effect is clericalist and patronising, although I expect most people won’t notice and it is the opposite of what the priest intends with his efforts to be friendly.

    I’m sure he’s a lovely man.

    I agree.
    At ours there is the official greeting as dictated from the Holy Spirit via a white dove bearing a golden quill, and then we get the other stuff (theme for the day, any special mentions etc)
    So all is fitting and seemly just as Our Lady of the Blessed Tabernacle Key would have it.
  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth Shipmate
    [Invoking the Holy Spirit]

    Any further mention of the practices at other churches will make you-know-who do you-know-what. And the Holy Spirit, having taken the form of a dove, will do what all birds do in abundance.

    [Ending said invocation by intoning Veni Sancte Spiritus]

    @Amanda B Reckondwyth
    Lead Editor, Mystery Worship
  • venbedevenbede Shipmate
    I take it Alan29 is being ironic but I can’t for the life of me see what his point is.
  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth Shipmate
    And we shan't discuss it further. Don't make Miss Amanda stamp her foot.

    @Amanda B Reckondwyth
    Lead Editor, Mystery Worship
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