Nonsense pictures of Ascension?

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Comments

  • MooMoo Kerygmania Host
    Jengie Jon wrote: »
    The case was that a large number of people at the time believed heaven was up so that is the way Jesus went..

    I think it's more the fact that if Jesus was going to leave earth, the only direction he could go was up. The disciples needed to see him leave, so they would realize that he would no longer be physically with them.

  • Mark BettsMark Betts Suspended
    edited November 2018
    Moo wrote: »
    Jengie Jon wrote: »
    The case was that a large number of people at the time believed heaven was up so that is the way Jesus went..

    I think it's more the fact that if Jesus was going to leave earth, the only direction he could go was up. The disciples needed to see him leave, so they would realize that he would no longer be physically with them.

    That's a good way to look at it. I think it is symbolic, in that heaven isn't just up in the sky, but a higher realm altogether. Yet something must have happened physically, for the disciples to see - which they relayed to St Luke, who included it in his Gospel.
  • Mark Betts wrote: »
    Mudfrog wrote: »
    All I would say is that something happened that day.
    They were on the hillside and Jesus was with them.
    I see no reason whatever to say this is a made-up episode or literary device - no more than any other miraculous happening in the gospels, or the entire Bible for that matter.

    We were not there and I would simply suggest that whatever happened, Luke wrote it down in the only language he had. The theology books tell us that it was all symbolic of a change in station and status, etc, and that is not untrue; but if that's all it was - all meaning and no event - then what's the point of the empty tomb, bearing in mind that the resurrection happened to Jesus and not to the disciples?

    I think perhaps a reverent silence on speaking too confidently about it being symbolic might be useful.
    My personal rule of thumb about some of the descriptions of events in the Bible is that there must have been much more to an event than we actually read, but there was never less.
    Yes, I'd go with that.

    Me too. I've heard many people say "it didn't happen this way" or "that way", but they leave their listeners in confusion. If St Luke was lying or misinformed, then what do they suppose did happen?

    "Luke" wasn't there either.
  • Martin54 wrote: »
    "Luke" wasn't there either.

    I never said he was.....
  • Nick Tamen wrote: »
    Eutychus wrote: »
    Although I've no idea where he was when he wasn't with any of our witnesses.
    Well, according to the Mormons ….

    He had other flocks to visit.... Yes, we know! :naughty:
  • Mark Betts wrote: »
    Martin54 wrote: »
    "Luke" wasn't there either.

    I never said he was.....

    I never said that you did.
  • BakerBaker Shipmate
    I saw part of an unusual movie depicting the life of Jesus, while I was channel surking. It was NOT "The Passion of the Christ" but all the characters depicted were speaking in their presumably native tongue. Jesus did go straight up, in a dignified manner. But the next scene is something I never saw in any such movie, it shows His arrival in Heaven. There's a crowd of folks waiting to greet him, and up in the front row, is the thief who was crucified beside Him, and spoke up to rebuke the other guy. He's happy and healthy and has a big, happy smile on his face.
  • Where's the other guy?
  • Baker wrote: »
    I saw part of an unusual movie depicting the life of Jesus, while I was channel surking. It was NOT "The Passion of the Christ" but all the characters depicted were speaking in their presumably native tongue. Jesus did go straight up, in a dignified manner. But the next scene is something I never saw in any such movie, it shows His arrival in Heaven. There's a crowd of folks waiting to greet him, and up in the front row, is the thief who was crucified beside Him, and spoke up to rebuke the other guy. He's happy and healthy and has a big, happy smile on his face.

    Ah, Saint Dismas no doubt.
  • Martin54 wrote: »
    Where's the other guy?

    We don't know - it's one of quite a few stories in the Gospels which don't have an ending - some might assume he went to Hell, but if so, the other thief's rebuke would have been to no avail - so maybe he was convicted of his sins and God had mercy on him too.
  • Surely not. Surely we are to be very mainly, 97%, damned on a good day for a brief life of weakness and ignorance?
  • Mark BettsMark Betts Suspended
    edited December 2018
    Martin54 wrote: »
    Surely not. Surely we are to be very mainly, 97%, damned on a good day for a brief life of weakness and ignorance?

    In a logical, legal sense perhaps, but we shouldn't underestimate the magnitude of His mercy.
  • For what?
  • Martin54 wrote: »
    For what?

    For nothing - Revelation shows us that God is of great mercy.
  • No, what have we done that we need mercy for? What have we done that God pathologically self-righteously wants to murder us all for?
  • God doesn't murder us - sin murders us.
  • What's that?
  • Martin54 wrote: »
    What's that?

    "The wages of sin is death" - it says nothing of God intervening.
  • Everything dies. What's that got to do with sin? Whatever that is.
  • Martin54 wrote: »
    Everything dies. What's that got to do with sin? Whatever that is.

    But why does everything die?
  • <admin mode in the absence of any available hosts right now>

    @Mark Betts, do I see you at the centre of yet another threadjack? If you persist in dragging threads way off-topic with blatant disregard for everything and everyone else, you can expect some shore leave. Consider yourself warned.

    @Martin54, stop yanking @Mark Betts' chain irrelevantly or do so on a dedicated thread. There seem to be open ones for both of you in Hell right now. You're becoming tiresome here too. No need to respond: just comply.

    </admin mode>

  • Martin54Martin54 Shipmate
    Might I venture that it is a nonsense picture of the Ascension to suggest that the other thief on the cross won't be in Paradise? Not that any of the dead of the previous two to four hundred thousand years at least would be 'up there' waiting for Jesus. That would be nonsense too. When did the afterlife start for humans? After the Ascension? Or has it yet? If not, when? And no, don't suggest any literal millennial scenario. They're all nonsense too.
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