Thank you for that link. Curious also to see on that page an offer, price reduced by 53%, for 10800, which must be one of the most obscure locos ever produced, even more so than the Tyneside electrics, also on that page, and Big Bertha, oddly in full red, which so far as I know, it never in its quite long life ever carried.
I actually saw 10800 at Derby, sort of in operation, i.e. it was not in the works but was not doing very much. Whatever colour its bogies might have been when it first appeared, they were ordinary grubby colour in use that day. In marketing terms, that must be a curiosity. There was only one. It did not do much. I've heard that mechanically it was a bit of a flop, and unreliable.
Manufacturers seem to be almost falling over themselves to produce models of obscure one-off locomotives! Some of these might have travelled around, but how do you justify Big Bertha on your layout, if you're not modelling the Lickey Incline? O I know - she's on her way to or from Derby Works...
Hornby have just released their new high-spec GNR J52 0-6-0ST, and Rapido are shortly following suit with different versions of the same engine - but how many people are going to want one? AFAIK they were humble shunters, so not especially useful for branch line passenger or local freight trains, although (of course) you can run your railway how you please.
If you were to build a model of Manchester Central, you'd need at least one to shunt the GN goods yard.
Which reminds me of an interesting factoid. A small engine shed was provided to house the shunters, but the end wall was high above the street and there were fears a loco might bash through it and fall on the street. So it was never used and the shunters lived at Trafford Park shed.
Well, a model of Manchester Central, or just the GN goods yard, would take up a lot of space - but a J52 would do nicely to work a minimum-space depot representing part of a much larger yard...
There is an impressive model not of Manchester Central but Liverpool Lime Street set 1945-48, in EM which is huge and yet has appeared at exhibitions. Googling it will give quite a number of filmlets on the internet. I have chosen a medium length example to link to. It has some excellent models and is fully signalled.
There is an impressive model not of Manchester Central but Liverpool Lime Street set 1945-48, in EM which is huge and yet has appeared at exhibitions. Googling it will give quite a number of filmlets on the internet. I have chosen a medium length example to link to. It has some excellent models and is fully signalled.
Someone has similarly done York, can’t remember the scale but it has been in Railway Modeller a few times in recent years.
I think York is N scale (perhaps unsurprisingly), but it might be 2mm finescale like Copenhagen Fields.
Splendid layouts, and a tribute to those who build and maintain them. IIRC, Cyril Freezer of the Railway Modeller sometimes produced plans of large layouts, best suited to a club or an informal group of friends, but most of his designs were intended to be built and maintained by one person, maybe with a few pals to help with more intensive operation, for instance if there were more than one station.
Does anyone remember the Sherwood layout - coarse scale 0 gauge - built and operated by Norman Eagles and his friends? It was enormous, housed in a specially-built *shed* (I can't think of a more suitable word!), but was capable of being operated in an entirely realistic manner. Even more remarkably, perhaps, it was worked by clockwork (aka spring-drive) locomotives, mainly of Midland and LMS prototypes.
The locos, stock, and many of the buildings were accurate models, but the scenery was basic, if not rudimentary. This didn't matter, as the point of the exercise was to simulate the running of a railway, and by all accounts they certainly achieved this.
On models, I remember with fondness the train set my dad built and visiting the hobby shop for new trains.
My favourite was New South Wales' XPT (express passenger train), built based on a British train which originally looked like this when introduced in 1982 -- and it is still going down to Melbourne and up to Brisbane and a few other places. Its latest paint job looks like this this I think. Never reached the speeds of the British one due to our tracks.
Yes, the XPTs are based on the British HSTs - one of our diesel success stories!
It's pleasing to hear that some are still in service in Oz, as (I think) some are still working in the UK.
They're called XPT ( for Express Passenger Train) here. While they're based in NSW, they do short interstate journeys to Melbourne and Brisbane as a part of their NSW service. In theory, their performance is not much below that of those in the UK. In practice, speeds reached in the UK are well beyond the capacity of track and lines here.
Not sure where to post this, but it's a good train story, capturing the essence of a certain breed of Scottish station staff perfectly:
In the 1970s Bert Houliston was an international jetsetter. (Well, he worked in Saudi Arabia.)
After 18 months in the desert his company rewarded him with a contract in Bangladesh, and he was scheduled to fly from Heathrow to Dhaka on January 3, 1979. But that New Year Glasgow Airport was closed due to heavy snow. On January 2 he phoned British Rail to check trains were running. He was informed that there was an overnight to London. So he asked when the next train left from his home in Saltcoats to Glasgow Central. Answer: "Ten minutes."
Bert and wife jumped in the car and sped to the station, just in time to see the train arrive. Our hero grabbed his bags while his wife ran on the platform, yelling at the guard: "Don't let the train leave. My husband's going to Bangladesh!"
Back came the inevitable reply: "No' on this train, hen. Glasgow Central's as faur as this train's gaun."
Just as Bert boarded, the guard announced: "This is the 18:46 train to Glasgow Central, calling at Kilwinning, Johnstone High, Paisley Gilmour Street, and terminating at Glasgow Central. Change at Glasgow Central for all stations to Bangladesh."
1. The man emigrating to America from a Glasgow suburb in the days of tramcars. On alighting at Glasgow Central (for onward rail connection to, presumably, Liverpool), the traveller was heard to say, "Well, that's the worst part of the journey over".
@Stercus Tauri Your Bangladesh story reminds me of when I was boarding a bus in Slough - a town well known for a certain confectionery factory. A lady asked "does this bus go to Mars?". The conductors immediate response was "yes, we take off in 5 minutes". Apologies for adding a road transport story to this railway thread
On my first visit, sometime last century, to the Gare du Nord in Paris, I was interested to see a big green Russian sleeping-car, complete with samovars, marshalled in an international train (this was long before Eurostar etc.).
Its ultimate destination was Moscow - a reminder to this insular Brit of how big Europe actually is.
About 10 years ago, my brother and his family went to their local station in Shropshire, armed with tickets for their ultimate destination - Ulaanbataar, Mongolia...
On my first visit, sometime last century, to the Gare du Nord in Paris, I was interested to see a big green Russian sleeping-car, complete with samovars, marshalled in an international train (this was long before Eurostar etc.).
On my first visit, sometime last century, to the Gare du Nord in Paris, I was interested to see a big green Russian sleeping-car, complete with samovars, marshalled in an international train (this was long before Eurostar etc.).
Did they change the wheels at the borders?
Yes, I'm sure they must have done! IIRC, the coach itself appeared no larger than the other coaches (some from Poland) in the train, but, of course, the Russian gauge is a sensible 5 feet, and not the awkward Stephenson coal-cart gauge...
Rocket was AIUI designed in such a way as to make sure the Stephensons won the Rainhill trials, and was very quickly modified when in regular service on coal or ballast trains...
Why, Hackworth's Sans Pareil might have won, despite being rather heavy and old-fashioned:
Those who run long trains of L&MR *glass coaches* behind their Hornby model of Rocket are not following prototype practice, given that L&MR passenger trains were mostly quite short - 5 or 6 coaches, including a blue open or two, and the mail coach - behind a Planet 0-2-2.
Come on, Rapido, we have Lion as a useful luggage engine - we now need a Planet, or a Sharp Stewart 2-2-2, and some generic 1830s/1840s coaches in green...then, I could build a diorama depicting the early days of my own local railway, the South Eastern!
Oh... here we go again... The classic Sharpie would be a delight, and more so would be the 'Jenny Lind', but what I would really like would be a Crampton - the original HST - not hard at all with modern design and manufacturing methods.
I've found a few videos of an apparently Swiss-made, 1970s, HO-gauge and live steam (!) Crampton here, see playlist! - Rocket and Sans Pareil were also made, and are shown the videos!
The story of L-S Loc can be found here. And if you enter 'L-S Loc' into a search engine of your choice, there may be more little films.
Just thought Platform 9 and 4/4 Shippies might enjoy this.
I've always loved model railways -though I no longer own a layout. We've just been on a little holiday to the Isle of Wight where we visited the Model Village at Godshill. It has a working model railway in G scale. I always think garden model railways have a special charm and romance about them. Possibly my favourite type of railway modelling.
I've found a few videos of an apparently Swiss-made, 1970s, HO-gauge and live steam (!) Crampton here, see playlist! - Rocket and Sans Pareil were also made, and are shown the videos!
The story of L-S Loc can be found here. And if you enter 'L-S Loc' into a search engine of your choice, there may be more little films.
Just thought Platform 9 and 4/4 Shippies might enjoy this.
This one did! Thanks @Wesley J - mind you, small-scale live-steam models have been seen from time to time (someone in the UK even built and operated 009 tram engines!), and IIRC Hornby dabbled in the genre (in 00) a while back. I haven't checked, but I don't think the range caught on, and I'm not sure if the locomotives are still available.
I've always loved model railways -though I no longer own a layout. We've just been on a little holiday to the Isle of Wight where we visited the Model Village at Godshill. It has a working model railway in G scale. I always think garden model railways have a special charm and romance about them. Possibly my favourite type of railway modelling.
Garden railways, in large or small gauges, do indeed have their charm, and I myself have dabbled in 16mm to the foot (2-foot gauge - or thereabouts -prototypes). I still have an antique Archangel *Marmaduke* (meths fired) and a more modern Roundhouse *Charles* (gas fired), which I used to run on Club layouts at exhibitions, or on fellow-modellers' garden lines. Such Fun !
For a year or so, around 1989, I had a small end-to-end garden railway, using Mamod track and battery locomotives, but I had to sell the house, so the railway never really developed. Surprising what you can do with only three sets of points, though!
We also visited the Isle of Wight Steam Railway which has quite a large collection of locomotives, I understand. We saw running the last 0-6-0 tank engine to have done active service for the MoD. I was surprised to read that another engine, Ryde, had done over 1.5 million miles!
Hornby dabbled in the genre (in 00) a while back. I haven't checked, but I don't think the range caught on, and I'm not sure if the locomotives are still available.
I don't think that it was any way compatible with their normal range, so something of a gimmick.
Hornby dabbled in the genre (in 00) a while back. I haven't checked, but I don't think the range caught on, and I'm not sure if the locomotives are still available.
I don't think that it was any way compatible with their normal range, so something of a gimmick.
Hmm. I thought it was compatible with their existing track and rolling stock, but yes, it certainly was a gimmick.
Were you perhaps thinking of their idiosyncratic live-steam 3.5 inch gauge Rocket ? That never caught on, either, though the coach was a nice model. Some of the range is available on eBay, at VERY silly prices.
It's a long time since I visited the IoW. The steam railway looks absolutely amazing. I remember it back in 1972, before it opened, when it was just a length of track with an island platform at one end. No running water, gas or electricity, all the rolling stock crammed together. It's amazing what has been achieved.
Ryde was the name given to one of the ex-LBSC class E1 0-60Ts transferred to the Island for goods duties. It became W3, and, given its age (the class dates originally from 1874/75), I can well believe that it achieved 1.5 million miles - as, indeed, did a lot of pre-grouping locomotives.
A Certain Manufacturer has recently introduced an 00 scale E1, in a wonderful variety of liveries! Reviews have been mixed - it's not 100% perfect by any means - but it's a lovely-looking locomotive. The LBSC goods green - not often seen on models - is especially attractive IMHO.
I've never been on the Isle of Wight Steam Railway since it became a heritage line, but I did travel from Ryde to Newport and back in 1962, on a day trip to the Island with my parents. I can't recall which locomotives we travelled behind, but they would, of course, have been 02s!
The present-day line is indeed a gem. Not a Mk1 coach in sight...
There are some Diseasels - none newer than 1959 though. What does give food for thought is that most the bogie coaches which seemed ancient in 1966 were actually newer than the (admittedly refurbished) HST coaches still in service today.
The fund for the first loco to be bought for the IoW Steam Railway was started by 3 students in London. Then the famous wildlife artist David Shepherd made a sizeable contribution.
Wasn't the Norfolk & Western the company which retained steam power for somewhat longer than many others?
Yes - an amazing railroad by all accounts, with a highly standardised fleet of mainline locomotives and a sophisticated system (lubritoriums) for servicing them.
Comments
I actually saw 10800 at Derby, sort of in operation, i.e. it was not in the works but was not doing very much. Whatever colour its bogies might have been when it first appeared, they were ordinary grubby colour in use that day. In marketing terms, that must be a curiosity. There was only one. It did not do much. I've heard that mechanically it was a bit of a flop, and unreliable.
Hornby have just released their new high-spec GNR J52 0-6-0ST, and Rapido are shortly following suit with different versions of the same engine - but how many people are going to want one? AFAIK they were humble shunters, so not especially useful for branch line passenger or local freight trains, although (of course) you can run your railway how you please.
Which reminds me of an interesting factoid. A small engine shed was provided to house the shunters, but the end wall was high above the street and there were fears a loco might bash through it and fall on the street. So it was never used and the shunters lived at Trafford Park shed.
Thanks @Enoch - very impressive indeed!
I think York is N scale (perhaps unsurprisingly), but it might be 2mm finescale like Copenhagen Fields.
Splendid layouts, and a tribute to those who build and maintain them. IIRC, Cyril Freezer of the Railway Modeller sometimes produced plans of large layouts, best suited to a club or an informal group of friends, but most of his designs were intended to be built and maintained by one person, maybe with a few pals to help with more intensive operation, for instance if there were more than one station.
Does anyone remember the Sherwood layout - coarse scale 0 gauge - built and operated by Norman Eagles and his friends? It was enormous, housed in a specially-built *shed* (I can't think of a more suitable word!), but was capable of being operated in an entirely realistic manner. Even more remarkably, perhaps, it was worked by clockwork (aka spring-drive) locomotives, mainly of Midland and LMS prototypes.
The locos, stock, and many of the buildings were accurate models, but the scenery was basic, if not rudimentary. This didn't matter, as the point of the exercise was to simulate the running of a railway, and by all accounts they certainly achieved this.
My favourite was New South Wales' XPT (express passenger train), built based on a British train which originally looked like this when introduced in 1982 -- and it is still going down to Melbourne and up to Brisbane and a few other places. Its latest paint job looks like this this I think. Never reached the speeds of the British one due to our tracks.
I also liked the model of this engine I had.
Fun days.
It's pleasing to hear that some are still in service in Oz, as (I think) some are still working in the UK.
I think there’s the Network Monitoring Train at Derby too. And of course the Midland Pullman and I think another railtour/charter set in blue/grey.
They're called XPT ( for Express Passenger Train) here. While they're based in NSW, they do short interstate journeys to Melbourne and Brisbane as a part of their NSW service. In theory, their performance is not much below that of those in the UK. In practice, speeds reached in the UK are well beyond the capacity of track and lines here.
In the 1970s Bert Houliston was an international jetsetter. (Well, he worked in Saudi Arabia.)
After 18 months in the desert his company rewarded him with a contract in Bangladesh, and he was scheduled to fly from Heathrow to Dhaka on January 3, 1979. But that New Year Glasgow Airport was closed due to heavy snow. On January 2 he phoned British Rail to check trains were running. He was informed that there was an overnight to London. So he asked when the next train left from his home in Saltcoats to Glasgow Central. Answer: "Ten minutes."
Bert and wife jumped in the car and sped to the station, just in time to see the train arrive. Our hero grabbed his bags while his wife ran on the platform, yelling at the guard: "Don't let the train leave. My husband's going to Bangladesh!"
Back came the inevitable reply: "No' on this train, hen. Glasgow Central's as faur as this train's gaun."
Just as Bert boarded, the guard announced: "This is the 18:46 train to Glasgow Central, calling at Kilwinning, Johnstone High, Paisley Gilmour Street, and terminating at Glasgow Central. Change at Glasgow Central for all stations to Bangladesh."
1. The man emigrating to America from a Glasgow suburb in the days of tramcars. On alighting at Glasgow Central (for onward rail connection to, presumably, Liverpool), the traveller was heard to say, "Well, that's the worst part of the journey over".
2. This poster, which I have in my office: https://www.rheidolrailway.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/01_Devil-max-700x600-1.jpg
Apologies for adding a road transport story to this railway thread
Its ultimate destination was Moscow - a reminder to this insular Brit of how big Europe actually is.
About 10 years ago, my brother and his family went to their local station in Shropshire, armed with tickets for their ultimate destination - Ulaanbataar, Mongolia...
Yes, I'm sure they must have done! IIRC, the coach itself appeared no larger than the other coaches (some from Poland) in the train, but, of course, the Russian gauge is a sensible 5 feet, and not the awkward Stephenson coal-cart gauge...
O dear. Yes, a most egregious error.
Why, Hackworth's Sans Pareil might have won, despite being rather heavy and old-fashioned:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sans_Pareil
Those who run long trains of L&MR *glass coaches* behind their Hornby model of Rocket are not following prototype practice, given that L&MR passenger trains were mostly quite short - 5 or 6 coaches, including a blue open or two, and the mail coach - behind a Planet 0-2-2.
Come on, Rapido, we have Lion as a useful luggage engine - we now need a Planet, or a Sharp Stewart 2-2-2, and some generic 1830s/1840s coaches in green...then, I could build a diorama depicting the early days of my own local railway, the South Eastern!
Or has it died (a bit like the Bloomer)?
https://register-of-charities.charitycommission.gov.uk/en/charity-search/-/charity-details/5062664/contact-information?_uk_gov_ccew_onereg_charitydetails_web_portlet_CharityDetailsPortlet_organisationNumber=5062664
The story of L-S Loc can be found here. And if you enter 'L-S Loc' into a search engine of your choice, there may be more little films.
Just thought Platform 9 and 4/4 Shippies might enjoy this.
This one did! Thanks @Wesley J - mind you, small-scale live-steam models have been seen from time to time (someone in the UK even built and operated 009 tram engines!), and IIRC Hornby dabbled in the genre (in 00) a while back. I haven't checked, but I don't think the range caught on, and I'm not sure if the locomotives are still available.
Garden railways, in large or small gauges, do indeed have their charm, and I myself have dabbled in 16mm to the foot (2-foot gauge - or thereabouts -prototypes). I still have an antique Archangel *Marmaduke* (meths fired) and a more modern Roundhouse *Charles* (gas fired), which I used to run on Club layouts at exhibitions, or on fellow-modellers' garden lines. Such Fun !
For a year or so, around 1989, I had a small end-to-end garden railway, using Mamod track and battery locomotives, but I had to sell the house, so the railway never really developed. Surprising what you can do with only three sets of points, though!
Hmm. I thought it was compatible with their existing track and rolling stock, but yes, it certainly was a gimmick.
Were you perhaps thinking of their idiosyncratic live-steam 3.5 inch gauge Rocket ? That never caught on, either, though the coach was a nice model. Some of the range is available on eBay, at VERY silly prices.
A Certain Manufacturer has recently introduced an 00 scale E1, in a wonderful variety of liveries! Reviews have been mixed - it's not 100% perfect by any means - but it's a lovely-looking locomotive. The LBSC goods green - not often seen on models - is especially attractive IMHO.
I've never been on the Isle of Wight Steam Railway since it became a heritage line, but I did travel from Ryde to Newport and back in 1962, on a day trip to the Island with my parents. I can't recall which locomotives we travelled behind, but they would, of course, have been 02s!
The present-day line is indeed a gem. Not a Mk1 coach in sight...
NB Not Norfolk & Western - they merged with Southern many years ago.
Sorry - temporary (I hope) insanity.
Yes - an amazing railroad by all accounts, with a highly standardised fleet of mainline locomotives and a sophisticated system (lubritoriums) for servicing them.