"Or to exchange ideas" - obviously that's what we're doing here. We've been doing it for almost 20 years, so we're pretty clear about it at this point.
"Or to exchange ideas" - obviously that's what we're doing here. We've been doing it for almost 20 years, so we're pretty clear about it at this point.
I agree that here the emphasis is on the exchange of ideas. I had issue with 'discussion' not including anything else.
"Or to exchange ideas" - obviously that's what we're doing here. We've been doing it for almost 20 years, so we're pretty clear about it at this point.
More than 20 years. I joined in 1999, and that was too late for some formative events for this community such as Hurricane Joanne.
Colin, I'm wondering how you expect discussions aimed at reaching a decision to happen on forums. In my experience, those kind of discussions are when a team of people, working together, need to make a practical decision on something they need to do. Hosts and admin of a discussion site might have such discussions privately, to work out what to do about certain situations in order to keep the site running smoothly. But discussion forums themselves are about ideas, with many different people joining in to discuss these ideas. You learn from each other, hone your own ideas, challenge your own ideas - a bit like when you are studying a subject like English at university, and you have seminars where you all analyse, say, a poem and share your ideas on it, and you may disagree with some people, and some people may give perspectives you hadn't thought of, but there is no definite answer everyone is seeking for, because it's complex and open to interpretation.
There have been many discussion forums online over the years. Facebook is more for chatting to friends and sharing memes, but even on Facebook, there are groups where people discuss ideas. I'm in a reading group, for instance, where we discuss poems, short stories and novels - purely with the intent of discussing. And also in a group for discussing politics. We don't reach an overall conclusion, because we all have different ideas. I would actually say discussing ideas in discussion forums is an excellent way for you to learn about different people and different perspectives, which will come in helpful for writing fiction and creating characters.
Also, of course, there are creative writing sites, where everyone is there because they are writing and would like feedback, and may also want to pick people's brains/experience to understand certain perspectives. Within a writing group, it is more appropriate, because you are all there with similar goals and supporting each other. Personally, if I am on a discussion board like S of F, where we are a kind of community and share about ourselves and our views, it feels a bit intrusive if a stranger comes along and says 'Hey, I'm writing a novel about people like you - can you tell me what is going on in your heads?' Feels like we're being viewed as zoo animals, almost. But within a writers' forum, if someone posted 'I'm wanting to write a character who is Anglican, but I'm atheist - is anyone here Anglican and willing to give me a bit of insight?' that would feel more natural, and equally someone else might post asking for an atheist perspective.
I am a new member of the ship. I've joined because I am writing a novel in which the narrator is a practising Christian and I wish to increase my knowledge of Christians and faith. My own beliefs are basically atheist, so you see my problem. Having apparently passed the 'no homework rule' my first post seemed to be well-received, see here: https://forums.shipoffools.com/discussion/1349/pending/p1 but I would like to go further and post some extracts from the novel where the Christian element is foremost.
My hope is people would find the extracts entertaining and amusing (that's what they are intended to do) while pointing out my omissions and failures.
My question is: 1) is that an appropriate use of the Ship of Fools and 2) if it is permissible where best should I put the extracts?
Having just now read this interesting thread through from start to latest post, I do wonder why you would want the narrator to be a 'practising Christian'. If you have never been a believer, I wonder how you could make such a character convincing.
Well, male authors write from female perspectives and vice-versa. Young authors write from the perspective of elders. Twentieth century people have written from the point of view of Ancient Romans and medieval monks and eighteenth century gentry. Sometimes writing outside your own box can be stimulating. And doing as Colin Smith is doing by talking to people who have the experience of practicing Christianity is a good way to get a feel for it.
Two of my favorite authors who wrote on spiritual matters were atheist/agnostic. They were Ursula K. LeGuin and Terry Pratchett. They wrote in ways about the spiritual that a believer might not and were all the better for it.
Well, male authors write from female perspectives and vice-versa. Young authors write from the perspective of elders. Twentieth century people have written from the point of view of Ancient Romans and medieval monks and eighteenth century gentry. Sometimes writing outside your own box can be stimulating. And doing as Colin Smith is doing by talking to people who have the experience of practicing Christianity is a good way to get a feel for it.
Two of my favorite authors who wrote on spiritual matters were atheist/agnostic. They were Ursula K. LeGuin and Terry Pratchett. They wrote in ways about the spiritual that a believer might not and were all the better for it.
Ah, yes, but I wonder - is there a big difference between writing from the first person in such cases instead of the third? I do not know, because I am 100% NOT a writer!!
I don't think I've ever read Ursula K Le Guin. Is there something shortish of hers you'd recommend? I've heard the name of course, but cannot recall reading anything by her.
Well, male authors write from female perspectives and vice-versa. Young authors write from the perspective of elders. Twentieth century people have written from the point of view of Ancient Romans and medieval monks and eighteenth century gentry. Sometimes writing outside your own box can be stimulating. And doing as Colin Smith is doing by talking to people who have the experience of practicing Christianity is a good way to get a feel for it.
Two of my favorite authors who wrote on spiritual matters were atheist/agnostic. They were Ursula K. LeGuin and Terry Pratchett. They wrote in ways about the spiritual that a believer might not and were all the better for it.
Ah, yes, but I wonder - is there a big difference between writing from the first person in such cases instead of the third? I do not know, because I am 100% NOT a writer!!
I don't think I've ever read Ursula K Le Guin. Is there something shortish of hers you'd recommend? I've heard the name of course, but cannot recall reading anything by her.
I've got to admit that the stories and books I'm thinking about are generally third person. Off the top of my head, I enjoyed Friday by Robert Heinlein, a first person story of a woman from the future. Which is funny because he was a pretty old school sexist but the book was still enjoyable to me. Another better one as a first person female is The Fault in Our Stars by John Green
As to LeGuin, I'd recommend Buffalo Gals, Won't You Come Out Tonight for a very good short story of hers. Also a pretty easy read to see LeGuin in spiritual mode (but no God) is the third book in her "Earthsea" series, The Farthest Shore. She published a good number of short story anthologies that you could browse.
The "blog section" is an entirely separate part of the site over which @Simon exercises editorial control.
The discussion here is about the forums, which are managed by the Hosts and Admins on a daily basis.
Thank you. I have only been here a few days so do not know how the whole site works. However, I was talking about how I might contribute to the site as a whole and the blogs are part of the site.
The discussion here is actually about how I can get what I want while keeping everyone happy.
Colin, I'm wondering how you expect discussions aimed at reaching a decision to happen on forums. In my experience, those kind of discussions are when a team of people, working together, need to make a practical decision on something they need to do. Hosts and admin of a discussion site might have such discussions privately, to work out what to do about certain situations in order to keep the site running smoothly. But discussion forums themselves are about ideas, with many different people joining in to discuss these ideas. You learn from each other, hone your own ideas, challenge your own ideas - a bit like when you are studying a subject like English at university, and you have seminars where you all analyse, say, a poem and share your ideas on it, and you may disagree with some people, and some people may give perspectives you hadn't thought of, but there is no definite answer everyone is seeking for, because it's complex and open to interpretation.
There have been many discussion forums online over the years. Facebook is more for chatting to friends and sharing memes, but even on Facebook, there are groups where people discuss ideas. I'm in a reading group, for instance, where we discuss poems, short stories and novels - purely with the intent of discussing. And also in a group for discussing politics. We don't reach an overall conclusion, because we all have different ideas. I would actually say discussing ideas in discussion forums is an excellent way for you to learn about different people and different perspectives, which will come in helpful for writing fiction and creating characters.
Also, of course, there are creative writing sites, where everyone is there because they are writing and would like feedback, and may also want to pick people's brains/experience to understand certain perspectives. Within a writing group, it is more appropriate, because you are all there with similar goals and supporting each other. Personally, if I am on a discussion board like S of F, where we are a kind of community and share about ourselves and our views, it feels a bit intrusive if a stranger comes along and says 'Hey, I'm writing a novel about people like you - can you tell me what is going on in your heads?' Feels like we're being viewed as zoo animals, almost. But within a writers' forum, if someone posted 'I'm wanting to write a character who is Anglican, but I'm atheist - is anyone here Anglican and willing to give me a bit of insight?' that would feel more natural, and equally someone else might post asking for an atheist perspective.
I appreciate my request is intrusive and of necessity I have an anthropological interest in people because I wish to depict people plausibly in my writing. I run a Facebook writing group and there's a combination of discussion and responses to specific questions on writing/publishing and related to research for writing. I accept that those in a writing group have a shared purpose.
I accept that I am out on a limb here which is why I came straight out and said what my aims were. It seemed disingenuous to lurk.
Several members of the SoF have been happy to share their worldview and I have gained a lot from them.
Having just now read this interesting thread through from start to latest post, I do wonder why you would want the narrator to be a 'practising Christian'. If you have never been a believer, I wonder how you could make such a character convincing.
It's tricky, which is why I am here. I have written from the perspective of a Russian Jewess living in 1850, the perspective of a modern young woman who has recently suffered a miscarriage, and from the perspective of a middle-aged man living on a Greek island at the end of the 21st century recounting his experiences as the last human being ever to be born and describing humanity's slow extinction.
Which is to say that I have done harder things than write from the perspective of a practising Christian.
I'm not bragging at all: writers have to so this. It's part of the job. Defoe was never shipwrecked. George Martin has never been to Westeros or committed incest. PD James never solved a murder.
The reason I chose practising Christian rather than anything else is it gives this character a false sense of certainty. Christian observance is his worry blanket: the thing that keeps him safe and makes his world seem secure. The story is really about people doing the thing that seems easy to avoid doing the thing that's hard.
Well, male authors write from female perspectives and vice-versa. Young authors write from the perspective of elders. Twentieth century people have written from the point of view of Ancient Romans and medieval monks and eighteenth century gentry. Sometimes writing outside your own box can be stimulating. And doing as Colin Smith is doing by talking to people who have the experience of practicing Christianity is a good way to get a feel for it.
The reason I chose practising Christian rather than anything else is it gives this character a false sense of certainty. Christian observance is his worry blanket: the thing that keeps him safe and makes his world seem secure. The story is really about people doing the thing that seems easy to avoid doing the thing that's hard.
And you were doing so well... I'd put the gun down now, before you're tempted to shoot yourself in the other foot.
The reason I chose practising Christian rather than anything else is it gives this character a false sense of certainty. Christian observance is his worry blanket: the thing that keeps him safe and makes his world seem secure. The story is really about people doing the thing that seems easy to avoid doing the thing that's hard.
I think you'll find that nobody is going to knowingly tell you what it's like to be in this category since nobody believes that they're in this category.
Unless you start from the preconception that all Christians are in this category anyway, the place to ask about people who fit into this category is a board for atheist or pagan ex-Christians who will tell you how they used to feel. (There are some ex-Christians on this board. You could try rephrasing your request, but I think that's even less promising as a discussion starter than the one you began with.)
OK, I'm going to pre-Host myself by saying that we need to keep this thread on-topic for the nominal purpose of clarifying activity that is appropriate for participation on the SoF. Hat tip to @Colin Smith for being forthright about it. If he, or anybody else, has any further questions about what we're hoping for, this is your thread.
Other than that, please drag the conversation regarding the merits of various writing philosophies to the appropriate topical discussion board. I, personally, am contemplating nipping down to Hell to yell at anyone who has failed to read Le Guin.
Edited to add:
I hear that you disapprove of invective, Caissa, and there's nothing wrong with how you feel. However, you have asserted this restriction many times over the years, and every single time you have been informed that invective is indeed allowed on all boards. Our fundamental answer is unlikely to change.
Would it be possible for everyone to just assume that you do not approve, so that we can dispense with you regularly appearing obtuse and stubborn?
The reason I chose practising Christian rather than anything else is it gives this character a false sense of certainty. Christian observance is his worry blanket: the thing that keeps him safe and makes his world seem secure. The story is really about people doing the thing that seems easy to avoid doing the thing that's hard.
I think you'll find that nobody is going to knowingly tell you what it's like to be in this category since nobody believes that they're in this category.
Unless you start from the preconception that all Christians are in this category anyway, the place to ask about people who fit into this category is a board for atheist or pagan ex-Christians who will tell you how they used to feel. (There are some ex-Christians on this board. You could try rephrasing your request, but I think that's even less promising as a discussion starter than the one you began with.)
I don't think anyone here is in this category. Nevil is what he is because he's a creature of his world and that world is a fantasy creation where the Norman Conquest and the British Empire never happened and where magic is real.
That said, Nevil observes Christian ritual and believes himself to be a Christian. To that extent he does have things in common with practising Christians in this world. I know why he believes himself to be a Christian because he's my invention, but I don't presume to know the motive, conscious or subconscious, of real people.
The reason I chose practising Christian rather than anything else is it gives this character a false sense of certainty. Christian observance is his worry blanket: the thing that keeps him safe and makes his world seem secure. The story is really about people doing the thing that seems easy to avoid doing the thing that's hard.
And you were doing so well... I'd put the gun down now, before you're tempted to shoot yourself in the other foot.
I'm talking about a fictional character I created. I do not presume to know or understand why anyone is a Christian. I wouldn't even presume to know why anyone is an atheist.
I assume personal insults like "obtuse and stubborn" are also allowed RooK. I shan't suggest you find a mirror. ;^) That said, I thought Hell was the place reserved for personal insults.
So, is it accepted that the discussion can continue (in Purgatory) to be largely framed about a shipmate's novel whilst a decision is made as to whether it is "homework" to discuss that very thing?
So, is it accepted that the discussion can continue (in Purgatory) to be largely framed about a shipmate's novel whilst a decision is made as to whether it is "homework" to discuss that very thing?
It looks to me as though discussion is continuing. And it will do unless and until H&A's see fit to put a stop to it. So far, that hasn't happened.
Not if it is a conscious, explicit, articulated mindset.
It wasn't when I began the thread. I have been upfront about what I'm doing because it seemed the honest approach. I could have just lurked in the background and hoovered up useful snippets as the came along but that felt wrong.
It looks to me as though discussion is continuing. And it will do unless and until H&A's see fit to put a stop to it. So far, that hasn't happened.
To be honest, my initial enquiry My question is: 1) is that an appropriate use of the Ship of Fools and 2) if it is permissible where best should I put the extracts? has been answered in the negative so as far as I am concerned this thread serves no more purpose. Fortunately, my 'pending' thread has had a lot of useful replies.
It wasn't when I began the thread. I have been upfront about what I'm doing because it seemed the honest approach. I could have just lurked in the background and hoovered up useful snippets as the came along but that felt wrong.
*sigh* thinking this is just about being honest is missing the point.
We like people to join here because they feel they have something to contribute to the discussion, not because they have found things to hoover up. That is not a viable long-term stance any more than coming here solely to peddle a pet belief is.
Some people might discover the site for self-interested reasons, but go on to look beyond their own immediate interests and become involved, interact with other posters, let their thinking be directed down other avenues, and so on. They end up contributing to the whole, accepting the terms on which our virtual community is organised, as well as getting a lot out of it.
You don't seem to have grasped that. Which is a pity.
*sigh* thinking this is just about being honest is missing the point.
We like people to join here because they feel they have something to contribute to the discussion, not because they have found things to hoover up. That is not a viable long-term stance any more than coming here solely to peddle a pet belief is.
Some people might discover the site for self-interested reasons, but go on to look beyond their own immediate interests and become involved, interact with other posters, let their thinking be directed down other avenues, and so on. They end up contributing to the whole, accepting the terms on which our virtual community is organised, as well as getting a lot out of it.
You don't seem to have grasped that. Which is a pity.
I have grasped that. I am commenting on other posts where I think I have something to contribute and I will continue to do so. Long term, however, I will not be here because I have yet to see what it offers as a forum that Facebook doesn't, other than the Christian element.
I think your ideal member is someone who is community-minded, and I admit that I am not. My focus is on writing and it is a very selfish activity.
I think your ideal member is someone who is community-minded, and I admit that I am not. My focus is on writing and it is a very selfish activity.
Yeah, about that. I'm 13 published novels in and I've been a host for what, 4 years now?
Well done. As ever I can only speak for me. I imagine you must have researched for your novels and often you will have researched things that were only of passing interest but needed to answer the pressing questions. That is my position here and now.
Discussion that it's possible to maintain for more than about a day, and refer back to years afterwards.
I see that. But it's not attractive or relevant to me.
I understand that for people who are actively engaged in a spiritual pursuit/exploration of some kind that it is helpful. I'm not engaged in any such pursuit.
Discussion that it's possible to maintain for more than about a day, and refer back to years afterwards.
I see that. But it's not attractive or relevant to me.
I understand that for people who are actively engaged in a spiritual pursuit/exploration of some kind that it is helpful. I'm not engaged in any such pursuit.
It’s true of all the discussions and threads here - not just the spiritual ones.
Long term, however, I will not be here because I have yet to see what it offers as a forum that Facebook doesn't, other than the Christian element.
There are plenty of Christian groups on Facebook, if Facebook is what floats your boat.
I think your ideal member is someone who is community-minded, and I admit that I am not. My focus is on writing and it is a very selfish activity.
You're right that the Ship is a community in a way that a Facebook group really isn't. Facebook can be used by communities, and one can even form communities within it, but it isn't set up to host discussions. Facebook makes it difficult to go back and find particular discussions again - its structure is essentially ephemeral and interrupt-driven.
Plus, the need to register and create an account to post on the Ship reduces the number of kneejerk instant outrage bandits that inject drive-by noise into the proceedings.
Does that mean that members need to be community-minded? No - there are plenty of regulars in the local pub who aren't community-minded at all, but are still part of the community. The Ship has space for the old man nursing a pint of mild in the corner.
Does that mean that members need to be community-minded? No - there are plenty of regulars in the local pub who aren't community-minded at all, but are still part of the community. The Ship has space for the old man nursing a pint of mild in the corner.
Thank you.
Oddly enough, I am in the pub but it's a pint of Stowford's cider.
I do have a Fb group but it's solely for writers and would-be members are vetted. I'd like it to be more of a resource but you're right that Fb doesn't make it easy to create anything of lasting value.
I do have a Fb group but it's solely for writers and would-be members are vetted. I'd like it to be more of a resource but you're right that Fb doesn't make it easy to create anything of lasting value.
Nonsense - I’m a host on a forum (for Labrador lovers, of course) we have like buttons. They make no difference at all.
I think the like, and other buttons, allow you to maintain a wider and more disparate network of people than you ever could if you had to comment on everything they post.
I think of the Like button as a kind of constructive feedback. If you run something up the flagpole and nobody salutes, you know not to post more in that vein. If you post something and you get a lot of likes, clearly that is the kind of thing to keep posting.
Long term, however, I will not be here because I have yet to see what it offers as a forum that Facebook doesn't, other than the Christian element.
And that's not terrible; not all forums are for all people. I've dipped my toe in various waters and found some were amenable to my way of going about things, my level of interest, and so on, and some were not. Doesn't mean it was a bad forum or I was a bad person.
I think your ideal member is someone who is community-minded, and I admit that I am not. My focus is on writing and it is a very selfish activity.
One can do a very selfish activity and not be a selfish person; similarly one can be selfish in one area and very open and giving in another.
Comments
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/discussion "the action or process of talking about something in order to reach a decision or to exchange ideas."
Quora is an interesting suggestion. Thank you.
I agree that here the emphasis is on the exchange of ideas. I had issue with 'discussion' not including anything else.
The "blog section" is an entirely separate part of the site over which @Simon exercises editorial control.
The discussion here is about the forums, which are managed by the Hosts and Admins on a daily basis.
There have been many discussion forums online over the years. Facebook is more for chatting to friends and sharing memes, but even on Facebook, there are groups where people discuss ideas. I'm in a reading group, for instance, where we discuss poems, short stories and novels - purely with the intent of discussing. And also in a group for discussing politics. We don't reach an overall conclusion, because we all have different ideas. I would actually say discussing ideas in discussion forums is an excellent way for you to learn about different people and different perspectives, which will come in helpful for writing fiction and creating characters.
Also, of course, there are creative writing sites, where everyone is there because they are writing and would like feedback, and may also want to pick people's brains/experience to understand certain perspectives. Within a writing group, it is more appropriate, because you are all there with similar goals and supporting each other. Personally, if I am on a discussion board like S of F, where we are a kind of community and share about ourselves and our views, it feels a bit intrusive if a stranger comes along and says 'Hey, I'm writing a novel about people like you - can you tell me what is going on in your heads?' Feels like we're being viewed as zoo animals, almost. But within a writers' forum, if someone posted 'I'm wanting to write a character who is Anglican, but I'm atheist - is anyone here Anglican and willing to give me a bit of insight?' that would feel more natural, and equally someone else might post asking for an atheist perspective.
Two of my favorite authors who wrote on spiritual matters were atheist/agnostic. They were Ursula K. LeGuin and Terry Pratchett. They wrote in ways about the spiritual that a believer might not and were all the better for it.
I don't think I've ever read Ursula K Le Guin. Is there something shortish of hers you'd recommend? I've heard the name of course, but cannot recall reading anything by her.
I've got to admit that the stories and books I'm thinking about are generally third person. Off the top of my head, I enjoyed Friday by Robert Heinlein, a first person story of a woman from the future. Which is funny because he was a pretty old school sexist but the book was still enjoyable to me. Another better one as a first person female is The Fault in Our Stars by John Green
As to LeGuin, I'd recommend Buffalo Gals, Won't You Come Out Tonight for a very good short story of hers. Also a pretty easy read to see LeGuin in spiritual mode (but no God) is the third book in her "Earthsea" series, The Farthest Shore. She published a good number of short story anthologies that you could browse.
Thank you. I have only been here a few days so do not know how the whole site works. However, I was talking about how I might contribute to the site as a whole and the blogs are part of the site.
The discussion here is actually about how I can get what I want while keeping everyone happy.
I appreciate my request is intrusive and of necessity I have an anthropological interest in people because I wish to depict people plausibly in my writing. I run a Facebook writing group and there's a combination of discussion and responses to specific questions on writing/publishing and related to research for writing. I accept that those in a writing group have a shared purpose.
I accept that I am out on a limb here which is why I came straight out and said what my aims were. It seemed disingenuous to lurk.
Several members of the SoF have been happy to share their worldview and I have gained a lot from them.
It's tricky, which is why I am here. I have written from the perspective of a Russian Jewess living in 1850, the perspective of a modern young woman who has recently suffered a miscarriage, and from the perspective of a middle-aged man living on a Greek island at the end of the 21st century recounting his experiences as the last human being ever to be born and describing humanity's slow extinction.
Which is to say that I have done harder things than write from the perspective of a practising Christian.
I'm not bragging at all: writers have to so this. It's part of the job. Defoe was never shipwrecked. George Martin has never been to Westeros or committed incest. PD James never solved a murder.
The reason I chose practising Christian rather than anything else is it gives this character a false sense of certainty. Christian observance is his worry blanket: the thing that keeps him safe and makes his world seem secure. The story is really about people doing the thing that seems easy to avoid doing the thing that's hard.
There is. But one still has to do one's best.
Thank you.
And you were doing so well... I'd put the gun down now, before you're tempted to shoot yourself in the other foot.
Unless you start from the preconception that all Christians are in this category anyway, the place to ask about people who fit into this category is a board for atheist or pagan ex-Christians who will tell you how they used to feel. (There are some ex-Christians on this board. You could try rephrasing your request, but I think that's even less promising as a discussion starter than the one you began with.)
Other than that, please drag the conversation regarding the merits of various writing philosophies to the appropriate topical discussion board. I, personally, am contemplating nipping down to Hell to yell at anyone who has failed to read Le Guin.
-RooK
Styx Host
Edited to add:
I hear that you disapprove of invective, Caissa, and there's nothing wrong with how you feel. However, you have asserted this restriction many times over the years, and every single time you have been informed that invective is indeed allowed on all boards. Our fundamental answer is unlikely to change.
Would it be possible for everyone to just assume that you do not approve, so that we can dispense with you regularly appearing obtuse and stubborn?
I don't think anyone here is in this category. Nevil is what he is because he's a creature of his world and that world is a fantasy creation where the Norman Conquest and the British Empire never happened and where magic is real.
That said, Nevil observes Christian ritual and believes himself to be a Christian. To that extent he does have things in common with practising Christians in this world. I know why he believes himself to be a Christian because he's my invention, but I don't presume to know the motive, conscious or subconscious, of real people.
I'm talking about a fictional character I created. I do not presume to know or understand why anyone is a Christian. I wouldn't even presume to know why anyone is an atheist.
That mindset does not bode well.
I believe that is the mindset by which all social animals get along.
It looks to me as though discussion is continuing. And it will do unless and until H&A's see fit to put a stop to it. So far, that hasn't happened.
It wasn't when I began the thread. I have been upfront about what I'm doing because it seemed the honest approach. I could have just lurked in the background and hoovered up useful snippets as the came along but that felt wrong.
To be honest, my initial enquiry My question is: 1) is that an appropriate use of the Ship of Fools and 2) if it is permissible where best should I put the extracts? has been answered in the negative so as far as I am concerned this thread serves no more purpose. Fortunately, my 'pending' thread has had a lot of useful replies.
*sigh* thinking this is just about being honest is missing the point.
We like people to join here because they feel they have something to contribute to the discussion, not because they have found things to hoover up. That is not a viable long-term stance any more than coming here solely to peddle a pet belief is.
Some people might discover the site for self-interested reasons, but go on to look beyond their own immediate interests and become involved, interact with other posters, let their thinking be directed down other avenues, and so on. They end up contributing to the whole, accepting the terms on which our virtual community is organised, as well as getting a lot out of it.
You don't seem to have grasped that. Which is a pity.
I have grasped that. I am commenting on other posts where I think I have something to contribute and I will continue to do so. Long term, however, I will not be here because I have yet to see what it offers as a forum that Facebook doesn't, other than the Christian element.
I think your ideal member is someone who is community-minded, and I admit that I am not. My focus is on writing and it is a very selfish activity.
Yeah, about that. I'm 13 published novels in and I've been a host for what, 4 years now?
Discussion that it's possible to maintain for more than about a day, and refer back to years afterwards.
Well done. As ever I can only speak for me. I imagine you must have researched for your novels and often you will have researched things that were only of passing interest but needed to answer the pressing questions. That is my position here and now.
I see that. But it's not attractive or relevant to me.
I understand that for people who are actively engaged in a spiritual pursuit/exploration of some kind that it is helpful. I'm not engaged in any such pursuit.
It’s true of all the discussions and threads here - not just the spiritual ones.
Thank you for suggested titles.
Note duly taken re LeGuin - this lack in my life will be remedied as soon as possible!
There are plenty of Christian groups on Facebook, if Facebook is what floats your boat.
You're right that the Ship is a community in a way that a Facebook group really isn't. Facebook can be used by communities, and one can even form communities within it, but it isn't set up to host discussions. Facebook makes it difficult to go back and find particular discussions again - its structure is essentially ephemeral and interrupt-driven.
Plus, the need to register and create an account to post on the Ship reduces the number of kneejerk instant outrage bandits that inject drive-by noise into the proceedings.
Does that mean that members need to be community-minded? No - there are plenty of regulars in the local pub who aren't community-minded at all, but are still part of the community. The Ship has space for the old man nursing a pint of mild in the corner.
Thank you.
Oddly enough, I am in the pub but it's a pint of Stowford's cider.
I do have a Fb group but it's solely for writers and would-be members are vetted. I'd like it to be more of a resource but you're right that Fb doesn't make it easy to create anything of lasting value.
If I had a like button, I'd be pushing it now
Nonsense - I’m a host on a forum (for Labrador lovers, of course) we have like buttons. They make no difference at all.
{You will notice I’ve stolen some of the circus ideas from here. 😝 }
I think the like, and other buttons, allow you to maintain a wider and more disparate network of people than you ever could if you had to comment on everything they post.
LeGuin is wonderful! I hope you enjoy her work as much as I do.
(You will recall my advice some while back on how to interpret a complete lack of response to one's posts...)
And that's not terrible; not all forums are for all people. I've dipped my toe in various waters and found some were amenable to my way of going about things, my level of interest, and so on, and some were not. Doesn't mean it was a bad forum or I was a bad person.
One can do a very selfish activity and not be a selfish person; similarly one can be selfish in one area and very open and giving in another.