My pet hate is when the film regency/ victorian era worship and use hymns with either words or tune (sometimes both) written much later.
In the Di Caprio-Winslet Titanic there is a service on board ship using words for Eternal Father, strong to save, that weren't included in hymnals until the 1930s.
There is an episode of the excellent Derry Girls in which a group of visiting children from Chernobyl are welcomed to Northern Ireland (Sr Michael: ' Try not to worry about the whole sectarian divide/civil war situation,the important thing to remember is that we're the goodies'). Given how pitch perfect this series is it's disappointing that this scene is obviously filmed in an Anglican church (rood screen, eagle lecturn etc) and not an RC church.
Recently I read a book in which the detective investigating a murder identified the mysterious item held by the victim as a set of rosary beads because he was raised a Catholic - he comments that his older sisters had rosaries, but because he was a boy, he didn't.
As it happens I have some experience in this area. The high school I attended was adjacent to a church at which the English poet Gerard Manley Hopkins served a curracy. When the BBC decided to make a dramadocumentary about the poet they decided they wanted to film some scenes in the church, including one of Hopkins celebrating Mass- I was dispatched to play the part of server (since I regularly did serve at the midday Mass).
The director chose one of the side chapels, having the necessary size, natural light and grandeur for the scene - the only problem, as the helpful sacristan pointed out was that the chapel had not existed in Hopkins' time. Consultation of sacristy registers did identify several altars which Hopkins had said Mass and one of these authentic locations was used. I recall that the actor was not allowed to use real vestments or a real chalice and paten, these were supplied by a theatrical costumier. The helpful sacristan was happy with vestments (Roman style chasuble in green with matching stole) but his eagle eye noticed that there was no maniple. For authenticity he reluctantly dug out one that was a close match. Viewers will be relieved to know that the stole was not only worn under the chasuble, but was also crossed over the breast correctly.
This was all great fun for me as I effectively got two days off school, with loads of free food and drink. I suspect that the most jarring part of the 30 seconds that made it on screen was my early 1980s explosion in a mattress factory hair - very unVictorian
Surplice in the pulpit is the commonest gaffe with Regency period Anglican clergy, followed by lighted candles and stoles.
Yes. Sanditon had that too.
Perhaps they think it all looks better, or more interesting, or more 'churchy', with surplice, coloured stole, lighted candles etc.?
A plain, unadorned church, and a Vicar in (I assume) Geneva gown, is not so visually appealing, I suppose, even if more accurate for the period.
Strictly speaking either a B.A./M.A. gown or a "pudding" gown, which is not a Genevan gown, but a descendant of the priest's gown of the early 16th century. The 'pudding gown' got its nickname from the pudding shaped sleeves, similar in shape to those of the modern bishop's rochet. I seem to recall that at one stage - probably the early 18th century - you could tell if a chap was High Church or Low Church by whether or not he wore an MA or a Pudding gown in the pulpit.
Surplice in the pulpit is the commonest gaffe with Regency period Anglican clergy, followed by lighted candles and stoles.
Yes. Sanditon had that too.
Perhaps they think it all looks better, or more interesting, or more 'churchy', with surplice, coloured stole, lighted candles etc.?
A plain, unadorned church, and a Vicar in (I assume) Geneva gown, is not so visually appealing, I suppose, even if more accurate for the period.
Strictly speaking either a B.A./M.A. gown or a "pudding" gown, which is not a Genevan gown, but a descendant of the priest's gown of the early 16th century. The 'pudding gown' got its nickname from the pudding shaped sleeves, similar in shape to those of the modern bishop's rochet. I seem to recall that at one stage - probably the early 18th century - you could tell if a chap was High Church or Low Church by whether or not he wore an MA or a Pudding gown in the pulpit.
Do you know any links to pictures of any of these gowns as they would have looked back then?
I recall a TV drama on the ABC (Australia) in which the vicar informed a woman deacon new to his parish that she could not conduct weddings or funerals as these required an "ordained minister". In the Anglican church. of course, all deacons are ordained (including Sydney diocese).
Yes, but they are ordained as deacons, not as priests/ministers. I am not sure about funerals, but the Marriage Act 1961 would prevent their carrying out marriages.
In the CofE, a deacon can take a wedding which will be valid, but it is not encouraged as they cannot pronounce the blessing. A person does not have to be ordained at all to do a funeral. Readers can, but in the local diocese are required to have been on an extra course first.
A deacon cannot, of course, conduct a nuptial or a requiem.
1. lead the Daily Offices, and the Litany;
2. preach if licensed to do so by the bishop;
3. bury the dead;
4. lead the liturgy of the word;*
5. baptize in the absence of the rector/vicar;
6. and solemnize marriages in accordance with the Canons of the Church, but they are unable to give the nuptial blessing.
[* - if a presbyter is present he should make the initial greeting, read the Collect of the Day and give the absolution.]
As a result of the last restriction regarding the nuptial blessing we tend not to register deacons as marriage celebrants with the Commonwealth. However, as the minister is there primarily as a witness to the vows, there would be nothing Canonically invalid in such a marriage, and if a deacon was temporarily in charge of a parish, the diocese would push the vestry to have that deacon registered as a marriage celebrant.
1. lead the Daily Offices, and the Litany;
2. preach if licensed to do so by the bishop;
3. bury the dead;
4. lead the liturgy of the word;*
5. baptize in the absence of the rector/vicar;
6. and solemnize marriages in accordance with the Canons of the Church, but they are unable to give the nuptial blessing.
[* - if a presbyter is present he should make the initial greeting, read the Collect of the Day and give the absolution.]
Lay readers can do 1 to 3.
1 to 4 here - for example, if a priest is not available for that part of the service (on account of rushing between churches in a multi-church benefice ).
If a priest is present, then yes, s/he should do what PDR's * suggests, but I don't think there are any hard-and-fast rules about it.
About blessings. Much discussion in RC circles as to whether lay eucharistic ministers should bless non-communicants who come forward - children, spouses etc. hand on head "May God bless you."
They do in our place and the folk appreciate it.
And deacons can bless by right.
A blessing is "only" a prayer after all.
Interesting. I come from a tradition which emphasises "the priesthood of all believers", so use the language of "us" rather than "you" when pronouncing blessings. For instance, "May the Lord bless us and keep us ..." etc.
That, in fact, is (and has always been) my practice as a Lay Reader, if called upon to offer such a prayer.
As @Alan29 says, a 'blessing' is a sort of prayer, anyway.
Re children, and others, who come to the altar along with communicants, there have been occasions (now rare) where we've had to have Communion by Extension as the main Sunday service.
I say something like 'N, may Our Lord Jesus bless, and keep, you, and may Our Lady of Walsingham pray for you' - cuz we're Anglo-Carflick, see, innit?
That, in fact, is (and has always been) my practice as a Lay Reader, if called upon to offer such a prayer.
As @Alan29 says, a 'blessing' is a sort of prayer, anyway.
Re children, and others, who come to the altar along with communicants, there have been occasions (now rare) where we've had to have Communion by Extension as the main Sunday service.
I say something like 'N, may Our Lord Jesus bless, and keep, you, and may Our Lady of Walsingham pray for you' - cuz we're Anglo-Carflick, see, innit?
Ooooh. We wouldn't do any of that Marian stuff at all. Makes I shudder, it do.
1. lead the Daily Offices, and the Litany;
2. preach if licensed to do so by the bishop;
3. bury the dead;
4. lead the liturgy of the word;*
5. baptize in the absence of the rector/vicar;
6. and solemnize marriages in accordance with the Canons of the Church, but they are unable to give the nuptial blessing.
[* - if a presbyter is present he should make the initial greeting, read the Collect of the Day and give the absolution.]
Lay readers can do 1 to 3.
1 to 4 here - for example, if a priest is not available for that part of the service (on account of rushing between churches in a multi-church benefice ).
If a priest is present, then yes, s/he should do what PDR's * suggests, but I don't think there are any hard-and-fast rules about it.
I forgot 'read the Gospel at Mass' which is very silly of me as that is one of the duties spoken of in the Ordinal. I would have to put that in as number 4 on my list and make 4 to 6 slip to numbers 5 to 7 instead.
I have a dim recollection that back in ASB days there was something about the priest, if one was around, saying the opening greeting, the collect of the day, and obviously the absolution, but otherwise the deacon could do everything from the beginning down to the peace. I think some Spiky purists used to insist on the priest giving the intonations for the Gloria and Creed, but that was not in the Instructions so it was a work of liturgical supererogation. I remember that at the Church of My Yowf that rule was always observed very punctiliously when we got a new assistant curate.
The issue of whether a Lay Reader can lead the ministry of the word does not come up in our parish as we will do MP or EP if there is no priest available. I am 95% certain the answer local is 'do what the rubrics say' but I would have to ask to be sure. With this crowd I would not even broach the subject of Communion by extension with a deacon presiding unless some sort of dire emergency were to occur such as me being out of action for six weeks and there being no substitute priest available.
1. lead the Daily Offices, and the Litany;
2. preach if licensed to do so by the bishop;
3. bury the dead;
4. lead the liturgy of the word;*
5. baptize in the absence of the rector/vicar;
6. and solemnize marriages in accordance with the Canons of the Church, but they are unable to give the nuptial blessing.
[* - if a presbyter is present he should make the initial greeting, read the Collect of the Day and give the absolution.]
Lay readers can do 1 to 3.
1 to 4 here - for example, if a priest is not available for that part of the service (on account of rushing between churches in a multi-church benefice ).
If a priest is present, then yes, s/he should do what PDR's * suggests, but I don't think there are any hard-and-fast rules about it.
Why not 5? Anyone can baptise although lay baptism is usually reserved for emergencies. On that basis, I baptised Dlet at his birth, as things were looking a bit dicey. At the church service his baptism was confirmed.
1. lead the Daily Offices, and the Litany;
2. preach if licensed to do so by the bishop;
3. bury the dead;
4. lead the liturgy of the word;*
5. baptize in the absence of the rector/vicar;
6. and solemnize marriages in accordance with the Canons of the Church, but they are unable to give the nuptial blessing.
[* - if a presbyter is present he should make the initial greeting, read the Collect of the Day and give the absolution.]
As a result of the last restriction regarding the nuptial blessing we tend not to register deacons as marriage celebrants with the Commonwealth. However, as the minister is there primarily as a witness to the vows, there would be nothing Canonically invalid in such a marriage, and if a deacon was temporarily in charge of a parish, the diocese would push the vestry to have that deacon registered as a marriage celebrant.
Lay readers can do 1 to 3.
Interesting as the CofE position is quite a lot different from that.
1. I don't think there's any actual rule on this but a reader can certainly do these, and also under certain circumstances a churchwarden. Historically, the Parish Clerk often took parts of the Litany.
2. I'm pretty sure that a deacon's licence automatically includes preaching. Readers also preach, and so can other people to some extent with the incumbent's permission.
3. Again, a deacon's licence automatically includes funerals. A reader can take a funeral but is expected to have undergone special training before doing so.
4. Again, both deacons and readers can do this. Liturgists would say that the person who will eventually preside should make the initial greeting, but it's quite a common practice for a reader or deacon to take the whole service up to the peace except for the absolution and either hand over at that point or function as a deacon thereafter. Only a priest can absolve or give a blessing as 'you' rather than 'may' and 'us'.
5. Deacons can baptise. Readers cannot.
6. Deacons can conduct weddings which have legal effect but cannot pronounce the blessing. For this reason, they do not normally do so. Readers cannot conduct weddings.
In addition:-
7. Banns must be read by the person present with the 'highest' status. So a deacon can only read banns if there is no priest present, a reader if there is no priest or deacon present and a churchwarden if there is no priest, deacon or reader present.
8. There is no requirement that only an ordained person can read the gospel. More 'precise' parishes may insist on this, but elsewhere there's very little awareness that there might be people who regard this as an issue, and especially not in rural areas. I think the position is different in Wales.
9. In the 1662 BCP Communion Service only a priest can read either the epistle or gospel, but I've no recollection as to how widely this was an issue back when all services were 1662. That does not appear to have been transposed into Order 2 in CW. Lay persons always have and frequently did read the lessons at Morning and Evening Prayer on a Sunday.
10. Deacons, readers and ordinands in training are automatically authorised cupbearers.
11. Weirdly, and inconsistently, bearing in mind the role of a permanent deacon, and that the oil is blessed by the bishop and then distributed, deacons can pray for the sick but cannot anoint them.
@Enoch - The CofE has modified its rules quite a bit since I left in 1994. Back then I seem to recall that the Gospel was directed to be read by a deacon or priest. In practice, in our neck of the woods MOTR and catholic parishes followed this to the letter; Evangelical parishes tended to sit a bit loose on this one unless there was an actual live deacon in the house.
I remember that one of the things that was dinged into me when I was being prepared for ordination is that although the rubrics in the 1662 Communion Service say the Epistle and Gospel are read by the priest, the ordinal made it clear that reading the Gospel was one of a deacon's duties. This is also hinted at by the provisions of the 1604 Canons. In the days before the Alternative Services, I seem to think that Lay Readers could read the Epistle if the Bishop of the Diocese allowed it - which they almost invariably did.
In my current diocese Readers are allowed to:
1. Lead the Daily Offices and the Litany
2. Bury the Dead
3. Read the liturgical Epistle
4. Preach if licensed to do so by the bishop.
5. Administer the chalice if licensed to do so by the bishop.
All of these ministries are undertaken under the direction of the parish priest, or the area dean or bishop if the parish is vacant. There is still a distinction between 'local' and 'diocesan' Readers, which in the main reflects the amount of training given to the two varieties. Local readers will usually have been trained by the parish clergy and examined by the area dean; whilst the diocesan reader will have had a significant brush with the Diocesan Training Institute, and the certificate to prove it. The current thinking seems to be that it should be as easy as possible for Diocesan Readers to become permanent deacons, but, perversely, no-one wants to create a permanent diaconate per se. With the exception of the handful of seminary trained clergy, what seems to be happening is that everyone starts as a reader and then moves up the ladder as they acquire the necessary training. As a lot of our parishes are small, and are served by the equivalent of what used to be called NSMs in the CofE this kind of makes sense. The average new priest in our diocese is in his mid-to-late 40s, is married with kids in high school, and has been studying part time for five to seven years before ordination to the priesthood.
The old Parish Clerk ministry still exists in some parishes, and they basically perform the same office as the Reader, but have some vestry (PCC) related responsibilities too. Most churchwardens are aware of the fact that they would technically have to step into the breach and read MP or EP in certain circumstances, and most, I think, fervently pray they do not have to do it. The rest are already readers.
Chalice bearers have never made much headway with us. There is an element in the laity do not like them, and they seem to be palatable only as an extension of the Reader/Parish Clerk ministries, and tend to be used as stop gaps in parishes where there is no deacon, and there really should be.
When it comes to the (optional) OT at the Eucharist, and the first and second lessons at Matins and Evensong anyone willing and able can read those. The restrictions willing and able are sufficient restriction on who can help in most circumstances!
Emergency baptism is something that anyone can do should the circumstance arise, as the BCP suggests.
I don't take much notice of minor vestimental hiccoughs/hiccups, but was pleased to see that Foyle's War (episode 1:1) predictably seemed fairly accurate a la 1940 as the vicar left the church to bury I can't remember who, wind blowing surplice and preaching scarf and generally setting a tone of triumphant misery
May have already been mentioned, but I'm bemused that in films there is always an organ playing when anyone walks into a church. Hilarious when it is Barnaby from Midsomer Murders checking on a body between the pews.
Granchester with a black Vicar? Would've ben run right out of the village even in the 1970's or 80's
You seem to be an expert on inadequacies and prejudices of a wide variety of peoples: 1970's villagers, Quakers, Anglican bishops, and no doubt many others.
I haven't seen the Sanditon adaptation, but remember from reading the existing chapters book that Jane Austen had a young black heiress as one of the characters. The past was a tad more diverse than we tend to imagine
There's also a fellow pupil at the school for young ladies that Amelia Sedley and Becky Sharp attend in Thackeray's Vanity Fair who is an heiress but clearly of mixed race. That would be during the Napoleonic Wars but written about 40 years later.
And neither of those characters suffer from racial prejudice, if memory serves. As I understand it, one or two members of a different group are not discriminated against as such. It is only when that group becomes large enough for some people to feel threatened that prejudice emerges.
May have already been mentioned, but I'm bemused that in films there is always an organ playing when anyone walks into a church. Hilarious when it is Barnaby from Midsomer Murders checking on a body between the pews.
And in a monastery, a group of monks is heard chanting at all times, even if in the foreground we're seeing the abbot meet with a detective (or someone), setting a fine example of absence from the work of God...not very Benedictine. Prefer nothing....
That, in fact, is (and has always been) my practice as a Lay Reader, if called upon to offer such a prayer.
As @Alan29 says, a 'blessing' is a sort of prayer, anyway.
Re children, and others, who come to the altar along with communicants, there have been occasions (now rare) where we've had to have Communion by Extension as the main Sunday service.
I say something like 'N, may Our Lord Jesus bless, and keep, you, and may Our Lady of Walsingham pray for you' - cuz we're Anglo-Carflick, see, innit?
And she (OLOW) will make more difference that the faithful elderly lady in the congregation?
That, in fact, is (and has always been) my practice as a Lay Reader, if called upon to offer such a prayer.
As @Alan29 says, a 'blessing' is a sort of prayer, anyway.
Re children, and others, who come to the altar along with communicants, there have been occasions (now rare) where we've had to have Communion by Extension as the main Sunday service.
I say something like 'N, may Our Lord Jesus bless, and keep, you, and may Our Lady of Walsingham pray for you' - cuz we're Anglo-Carflick, see, innit?
And she (OLOW) will make more difference that the faithful elderly lady in the congregation?
I am not sure there is much difference but being British it would be unfair to single out Mrs Mavis Jones as a person of serious prayer by asking her to pray publicly for everyone in the congregation. Mrs Mavis Jones is quite likely to be upset and you maybe handbagged. OLOW on the other hand is at a safe distance.
The recent Netflix series, The Crown, attracted a lot of comment about how far the dramatised events strayed from historical facts; not that I cared much, but when HM the Queen visited the Welsh mining village of Aberfan, and was invited into a nearby chapel to pray AT A PRIE-DIEU with lots of candles in front of a glistening cross, I must admit that I did scoff a bit.
The recent Netflix series, The Crown, attracted a lot of comment about how far the dramatised events strayed from historical facts; not that I cared much, but when HM the Queen visited the Welsh mining village of Aberfan, and was invited into a nearby chapel to pray AT A PRIE-DIEU with lots of candles in front of a glistening cross, I must admit that I did scoff a bit.
The townspeople sang the hymn "Jesu, lover of my soul" a bit weirdly...they kept repeating the first couple of lines of the tune (Aberystwyth) in a way I've never seen in any hymnal. I wonder if that's the best choice for a "Welsh hymn," though...the text is by Wesley.
Candles and glistening cross definitely not a feature of the typical Calvanistic Methodist chaple, though I suppose it's possible a prie-dieu was found for HMQ, if this event actually took place.
Aberystwyth is a Welsh tune, but the hymn most associated with the events of Aberfan is O Iesu Mawr (O Great Jesus) usually just known as Llef (A cry) in Wales. It was sung at my grandmother's funeral. There are several excellent versions on YouTube: you need no knowledge of the Welsh tongue to be moved to tears when hearing it.
Call the Midwife (Christmas 2019): would anyone like to comment on the reception an Anglican mission to the Isle of Harris would have got in the 1960s?
Rather harder to accept in dramatic terms is that two simultaneous storylines involved one group of nuns/nurses being unable to get a boat to the lighthouse as the ferryman wouldn't work on the Sabbath while another group had to treat a little girl hurt when her mother was away working at making tweed.
Either it was the Sabbath and no one would have been making tweed, or it wasn't and the ferryman would have been doing his job. C-. Sloppy. See me.
Call the Midwife (Christmas 2019): would anyone like to comment on the reception an Anglican mission to the Isle of Harris would have got in the 1960s?
Rather harder to accept in dramatic terms is that two simultaneous storylines involved one group of nuns/nurses being unable to get a boat to the lighthouse as the ferryman wouldn't work on the Sabbath while another group had to treat a little girl hurt when her mother was away working at making tweed.
Either it was the Sabbath and no one would have been making tweed, or it wasn't and the ferryman would have been doing his job. C-. Sloppy. See me.
I wouldn't be surprised if even in the 60s Sabbatarianism was patchy. The differences in observance between the wee wee frees, the wee frees, the kirk, the piskies and the catholics could account for the variety. Certainly today the strict Sabbath observance on Lewis does not pertain on (predominantly RC) Barra. As to the reception of Anglican nuns in Harris in the 60s, I imagine the Calvinists considered them tantamount to popery, but how much most folk would have cared I couldn't say.
Several posters on this thread have mentioned film music and how jarring it can be when, in a church or other religious setting, the score on the soundtrack is inappropriate, either because it’s anachronistic or for any other reason. I remember when I first watched Kenneth Branagh’s Henry V, I wondered about the choral setting of the Non nobis Domine heard on the soundtrack in the aftermath of the battle. It certainly didn’t sound medieval, but it didn’t sound modern either. I was quite surprised when I found it was the work of a living composer, in fact the same composer who had written the score for the whole film, Patrick Doyle. That name was wholly new to me at the time. It was a remarkable achievement, I think, for him to have composed a piece that suited the onscreen action so effectively, without resorting to any mock-medieval fakery.
Arched “Tommy’s Honour” on BBC Scotland. Not bad. But when Tommy Morris is getting married he is told “you my kiss the bride” - in a Church of Scotland in the 1870s? I doubt it, I doubt it very much.
(Since I grew up in St. Andrews and my Grandparents lived in Tom Morris Drive, and there are Morrisses in the family tree, I did enjoy the film! Even though most of it wasn’t filmed there - couldn’t be: the background streetscapes would be wrong.)
May have already been mentioned, but I'm bemused that in films there is always an organ playing when anyone walks into a church. Hilarious when it is Barnaby from Midsomer Murders checking on a body between the pews.
And in a monastery, a group of monks is heard chanting at all times, even if in the foreground we're seeing the abbot meet with a detective (or someone), setting a fine example of absence from the work of God...not very Benedictine. Prefer nothing....
Which reminds me of something which always impresses me favourably, whenever I watch my Cadfael CDs. Whatever else they may get wrong (for all I know), whenever the guys are in choir chanting, all the extras and actors' are at least mouthing the correct words at the right time, as if they really were singing! Considering it's in Plainsong and in Latin, I think it's a realistic detail that is of great credit to the production.
Comments
In the Di Caprio-Winslet Titanic there is a service on board ship using words for Eternal Father, strong to save, that weren't included in hymnals until the 1930s.
Perhaps they think it all looks better, or more interesting, or more 'churchy', with surplice, coloured stole, lighted candles etc.?
A plain, unadorned church, and a Vicar in (I assume) Geneva gown, is not so visually appealing, I suppose, even if more accurate for the period.
There is an episode of the excellent Derry Girls in which a group of visiting children from Chernobyl are welcomed to Northern Ireland (Sr Michael: ' Try not to worry about the whole sectarian divide/civil war situation,the important thing to remember is that we're the goodies'). Given how pitch perfect this series is it's disappointing that this scene is obviously filmed in an Anglican church (rood screen, eagle lecturn etc) and not an RC church.
Recently I read a book in which the detective investigating a murder identified the mysterious item held by the victim as a set of rosary beads because he was raised a Catholic - he comments that his older sisters had rosaries, but because he was a boy, he didn't.
As it happens I have some experience in this area. The high school I attended was adjacent to a church at which the English poet Gerard Manley Hopkins served a curracy. When the BBC decided to make a dramadocumentary about the poet they decided they wanted to film some scenes in the church, including one of Hopkins celebrating Mass- I was dispatched to play the part of server (since I regularly did serve at the midday Mass).
The director chose one of the side chapels, having the necessary size, natural light and grandeur for the scene - the only problem, as the helpful sacristan pointed out was that the chapel had not existed in Hopkins' time. Consultation of sacristy registers did identify several altars which Hopkins had said Mass and one of these authentic locations was used. I recall that the actor was not allowed to use real vestments or a real chalice and paten, these were supplied by a theatrical costumier. The helpful sacristan was happy with vestments (Roman style chasuble in green with matching stole) but his eagle eye noticed that there was no maniple. For authenticity he reluctantly dug out one that was a close match. Viewers will be relieved to know that the stole was not only worn under the chasuble, but was also crossed over the breast correctly.
This was all great fun for me as I effectively got two days off school, with loads of free food and drink. I suspect that the most jarring part of the 30 seconds that made it on screen was my early 1980s explosion in a mattress factory hair - very unVictorian
Obviously, the budget didn't run to a jar of Brylcre*m, with which to plaster down your Hair!
Strictly speaking either a B.A./M.A. gown or a "pudding" gown, which is not a Genevan gown, but a descendant of the priest's gown of the early 16th century. The 'pudding gown' got its nickname from the pudding shaped sleeves, similar in shape to those of the modern bishop's rochet. I seem to recall that at one stage - probably the early 18th century - you could tell if a chap was High Church or Low Church by whether or not he wore an MA or a Pudding gown in the pulpit.
Do you know any links to pictures of any of these gowns as they would have looked back then?
Thanks.
A deacon cannot, of course, conduct a nuptial or a requiem.
1. lead the Daily Offices, and the Litany;
2. preach if licensed to do so by the bishop;
3. bury the dead;
4. lead the liturgy of the word;*
5. baptize in the absence of the rector/vicar;
6. and solemnize marriages in accordance with the Canons of the Church, but they are unable to give the nuptial blessing.
[* - if a presbyter is present he should make the initial greeting, read the Collect of the Day and give the absolution.]
As a result of the last restriction regarding the nuptial blessing we tend not to register deacons as marriage celebrants with the Commonwealth. However, as the minister is there primarily as a witness to the vows, there would be nothing Canonically invalid in such a marriage, and if a deacon was temporarily in charge of a parish, the diocese would push the vestry to have that deacon registered as a marriage celebrant.
Lay readers can do 1 to 3.
1 to 4 here - for example, if a priest is not available for that part of the service (on account of rushing between churches in a multi-church benefice
If a priest is present, then yes, s/he should do what PDR's * suggests, but I don't think there are any hard-and-fast rules about it.
They do in our place and the folk appreciate it.
And deacons can bless by right.
A blessing is "only" a prayer after all.
As @Alan29 says, a 'blessing' is a sort of prayer, anyway.
Re children, and others, who come to the altar along with communicants, there have been occasions (now rare) where we've had to have Communion by Extension as the main Sunday service.
I say something like 'N, may Our Lord Jesus bless, and keep, you, and may Our Lady of Walsingham pray for you' - cuz we're Anglo-Carflick, see, innit?
Ooooh. We wouldn't do any of that Marian stuff at all. Makes I shudder, it do.
That would only happen on the other side of the Thames Estuary.
I forgot 'read the Gospel at Mass' which is very silly of me as that is one of the duties spoken of in the Ordinal. I would have to put that in as number 4 on my list and make 4 to 6 slip to numbers 5 to 7 instead.
I have a dim recollection that back in ASB days there was something about the priest, if one was around, saying the opening greeting, the collect of the day, and obviously the absolution, but otherwise the deacon could do everything from the beginning down to the peace. I think some Spiky purists used to insist on the priest giving the intonations for the Gloria and Creed, but that was not in the Instructions so it was a work of liturgical supererogation. I remember that at the Church of My Yowf that rule was always observed very punctiliously when we got a new assistant curate.
The issue of whether a Lay Reader can lead the ministry of the word does not come up in our parish as we will do MP or EP if there is no priest available. I am 95% certain the answer local is 'do what the rubrics say' but I would have to ask to be sure. With this crowd I would not even broach the subject of Communion by extension with a deacon presiding unless some sort of dire emergency were to occur such as me being out of action for six weeks and there being no substitute priest available.
Why not 5? Anyone can baptise although lay baptism is usually reserved for emergencies. On that basis, I baptised Dlet at his birth, as things were looking a bit dicey. At the church service his baptism was confirmed.
1. I don't think there's any actual rule on this but a reader can certainly do these, and also under certain circumstances a churchwarden. Historically, the Parish Clerk often took parts of the Litany.
2. I'm pretty sure that a deacon's licence automatically includes preaching. Readers also preach, and so can other people to some extent with the incumbent's permission.
3. Again, a deacon's licence automatically includes funerals. A reader can take a funeral but is expected to have undergone special training before doing so.
4. Again, both deacons and readers can do this. Liturgists would say that the person who will eventually preside should make the initial greeting, but it's quite a common practice for a reader or deacon to take the whole service up to the peace except for the absolution and either hand over at that point or function as a deacon thereafter. Only a priest can absolve or give a blessing as 'you' rather than 'may' and 'us'.
5. Deacons can baptise. Readers cannot.
6. Deacons can conduct weddings which have legal effect but cannot pronounce the blessing. For this reason, they do not normally do so. Readers cannot conduct weddings.
In addition:-
7. Banns must be read by the person present with the 'highest' status. So a deacon can only read banns if there is no priest present, a reader if there is no priest or deacon present and a churchwarden if there is no priest, deacon or reader present.
8. There is no requirement that only an ordained person can read the gospel. More 'precise' parishes may insist on this, but elsewhere there's very little awareness that there might be people who regard this as an issue, and especially not in rural areas. I think the position is different in Wales.
9. In the 1662 BCP Communion Service only a priest can read either the epistle or gospel, but I've no recollection as to how widely this was an issue back when all services were 1662. That does not appear to have been transposed into Order 2 in CW. Lay persons always have and frequently did read the lessons at Morning and Evening Prayer on a Sunday.
10. Deacons, readers and ordinands in training are automatically authorised cupbearers.
11. Weirdly, and inconsistently, bearing in mind the role of a permanent deacon, and that the oil is blessed by the bishop and then distributed, deacons can pray for the sick but cannot anoint them.
I remember that one of the things that was dinged into me when I was being prepared for ordination is that although the rubrics in the 1662 Communion Service say the Epistle and Gospel are read by the priest, the ordinal made it clear that reading the Gospel was one of a deacon's duties. This is also hinted at by the provisions of the 1604 Canons. In the days before the Alternative Services, I seem to think that Lay Readers could read the Epistle if the Bishop of the Diocese allowed it - which they almost invariably did.
In my current diocese Readers are allowed to:
1. Lead the Daily Offices and the Litany
2. Bury the Dead
3. Read the liturgical Epistle
4. Preach if licensed to do so by the bishop.
5. Administer the chalice if licensed to do so by the bishop.
All of these ministries are undertaken under the direction of the parish priest, or the area dean or bishop if the parish is vacant. There is still a distinction between 'local' and 'diocesan' Readers, which in the main reflects the amount of training given to the two varieties. Local readers will usually have been trained by the parish clergy and examined by the area dean; whilst the diocesan reader will have had a significant brush with the Diocesan Training Institute, and the certificate to prove it. The current thinking seems to be that it should be as easy as possible for Diocesan Readers to become permanent deacons, but, perversely, no-one wants to create a permanent diaconate per se. With the exception of the handful of seminary trained clergy, what seems to be happening is that everyone starts as a reader and then moves up the ladder as they acquire the necessary training. As a lot of our parishes are small, and are served by the equivalent of what used to be called NSMs in the CofE this kind of makes sense. The average new priest in our diocese is in his mid-to-late 40s, is married with kids in high school, and has been studying part time for five to seven years before ordination to the priesthood.
The old Parish Clerk ministry still exists in some parishes, and they basically perform the same office as the Reader, but have some vestry (PCC) related responsibilities too. Most churchwardens are aware of the fact that they would technically have to step into the breach and read MP or EP in certain circumstances, and most, I think, fervently pray they do not have to do it. The rest are already readers.
Chalice bearers have never made much headway with us. There is an element in the laity do not like them, and they seem to be palatable only as an extension of the Reader/Parish Clerk ministries, and tend to be used as stop gaps in parishes where there is no deacon, and there really should be.
When it comes to the (optional) OT at the Eucharist, and the first and second lessons at Matins and Evensong anyone willing and able can read those. The restrictions willing and able are sufficient restriction on who can help in most circumstances!
Emergency baptism is something that anyone can do should the circumstance arise, as the BCP suggests.
You seem to be an expert on inadequacies and prejudices of a wide variety of peoples: 1970's villagers, Quakers, Anglican bishops, and no doubt many others.
https://www.africansinyorkshireproject.com/rev-cragg-haynes.html
I haven't seen the Sanditon adaptation, but remember from reading the existing chapters book that Jane Austen had a young black heiress as one of the characters. The past was a tad more diverse than we tend to imagine
And in a monastery, a group of monks is heard chanting at all times, even if in the foreground we're seeing the abbot meet with a detective (or someone), setting a fine example of absence from the work of God...not very Benedictine. Prefer nothing....
And she (OLOW) will make more difference that the faithful elderly lady in the congregation?
I am not sure there is much difference but being British it would be unfair to single out Mrs Mavis Jones as a person of serious prayer by asking her to pray publicly for everyone in the congregation. Mrs Mavis Jones is quite likely to be upset and you maybe handbagged. OLOW on the other hand is at a safe distance.
The townspeople sang the hymn "Jesu, lover of my soul" a bit weirdly...they kept repeating the first couple of lines of the tune (Aberystwyth) in a way I've never seen in any hymnal. I wonder if that's the best choice for a "Welsh hymn," though...the text is by Wesley.
Aberystwyth is a Welsh tune, but the hymn most associated with the events of Aberfan is O Iesu Mawr (O Great Jesus) usually just known as Llef (A cry) in Wales. It was sung at my grandmother's funeral. There are several excellent versions on YouTube: you need no knowledge of the Welsh tongue to be moved to tears when hearing it.
Rather harder to accept in dramatic terms is that two simultaneous storylines involved one group of nuns/nurses being unable to get a boat to the lighthouse as the ferryman wouldn't work on the Sabbath while another group had to treat a little girl hurt when her mother was away working at making tweed.
Either it was the Sabbath and no one would have been making tweed, or it wasn't and the ferryman would have been doing his job. C-. Sloppy. See me.
I wouldn't be surprised if even in the 60s Sabbatarianism was patchy. The differences in observance between the wee wee frees, the wee frees, the kirk, the piskies and the catholics could account for the variety. Certainly today the strict Sabbath observance on Lewis does not pertain on (predominantly RC) Barra. As to the reception of Anglican nuns in Harris in the 60s, I imagine the Calvinists considered them tantamount to popery, but how much most folk would have cared I couldn't say.
(Since I grew up in St. Andrews and my Grandparents lived in Tom Morris Drive, and there are Morrisses in the family tree, I did enjoy the film! Even though most of it wasn’t filmed there - couldn’t be: the background streetscapes would be wrong.)
Which reminds me of something which always impresses me favourably, whenever I watch my Cadfael CDs. Whatever else they may get wrong (for all I know), whenever the guys are in choir chanting, all the extras and actors' are at least mouthing the correct words at the right time, as if they really were singing! Considering it's in Plainsong and in Latin, I think it's a realistic detail that is of great credit to the production.