In the part of the North I am from we have butter pie. That is short party filled with sliced potato, onion and an artery clogging amount of salty butter. I miss it.
My mum made great pies - I had older brothers and they needed filling up on such things. At university Cherry Pie was one of my signature dishes.
I haven't made a pie for years, on account of the calories, the cholesterol, and the gluten intolerance of Mr Nen. When it is just the two of us we hardly ever have dessert at home - hence it's such a treat when we go out. If there's a choice, I'll always have mains and dessert rather than starter and mains. Last time we went out I had an amazing dessert of chocolate fudge brownie, hazelnut purée and vanilla ice cream.
My go-to dessert at home when we Have Company is strawberries and blueberries with cream, ice cream or fromage frais. Sometimes I go wild and throw in a meringue nest as well.
This is the second page of this thread and there has been no discussion of Proper Dessert: to wit, pie. Is Outrage!
Coconut Creme Pie or Apple Pie by preference, though lemon meringue is fine. I can live without the a la mode.
Well, I mentioned my mother’s chocolate pie (essentially a chocolate chess pie) very early on in the thread. I also mentioned key lime pie, and @Pangolin Guerre spoke of the best pumpkin pie he’d ever had.
I’m currently mourning the closing of a long-time cafeteria here. It was an institution, but it couldn’t survive COVID. One of my favorite things on their menu was the buttered coconut pie. Heaven on a plate.
Pecan pie is actually the prime example to me of how restaurant desserts can be really good or really bad. A good pecan pie is divine. A bad one, on the other hand, is a huge disappointment at the loss of what could have been.
Pecan pie went through a phase of popularity here 25 or so years ago, particularly at coffee shops. That ran for a few years and the pie's not been seen since.
Pecan pie went through a phase of popularity here 25 or so years ago, particularly at coffee shops. That ran for a few years and the pie's not been seen since.
This thread shows why quality desserts are neither sought nor paid for.
People (in this thread) don't want high quality. They want nostalgia. They remember sweets their moms used to make. Unless their mothers were exceptionally capable home bakers, the vast majority of these will be pretty run-of-the-mill. So why would they pursue and pay for culinary achievement?
This thread shows why quality desserts are neither sought nor paid for.
People (in this thread) don't want high quality. They want nostalgia. They remember sweets their moms used to make. Unless their mothers were exceptionally capable home bakers, the vast majority of these will be pretty run-of-the-mill. So why would they pursue and pay for culinary achievement?
Our perception of food is so much more than the ingredients used to make it. Memories, presentation, price; there are a number of things that make us think something tastes better than it does. Which is fine, like is like, whatever the reason.
But, yes, most people do not have a reference for quality food. Otherwise McDonald's and Greggs would not be as popular as they are.
Although they also enjoy apple pie with a slice of a nice Cheddar on top.
We have a marvelous recipe—which my wife got from a local restaurant, knowing it was my favorite thing on their menu—for a ham and apple pie, topped with cheddar. Yes, it’s a main dish, not a dessert. It has often appeared for my birthday.
We've just had lunch Out. The dessert was described as 'Pornstar Martini Eton Mess' - actually some sort of diced fruit - possibly mango - in cream and meringue and a smidgen of vodka.
That and the Apple Snow I made last night have used up my whipped cream entitlement for the next six months.
On the nostalgia front, I can't honestly think of any childhood food I'd pine for, or which I couldn't do as well or better if I did.
Back into comfort food territory, when Mum was short of time, plain suet pudding with, on the table for us to choose from, butter, white sugar, brown sugar, golden syrup, jam, possibly marmalade.
This thread shows why quality desserts are neither sought nor paid for.
People (in this thread) don't want high quality. They want nostalgia. They remember sweets their moms used to make. Unless their mothers were exceptionally capable home bakers, the vast majority of these will be pretty run-of-the-mill. So why would they pursue and pay for culinary achievement?
I don’t buy that. Or as we would say here, that dog won’t hunt.
Lots of us are perfectly capable of appreciating good home baking, including our mothers’ or grandmothers’ (or fathers’) home baking, and well done baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home. It’s not either/or. Sometimes we want and prefer the familiar. Sometimes we want and expect the special.
By your theory, we’d all prefer the nostalgia of all the food we grew up on, and no restaurants would bother with anything other than the run-of-the-mill we could just as easily cook at home. It’s not the simple.
We have a marvelous recipe—which my wife got from a local restaurant, knowing it was my favorite thing on their menu—for a ham and apple pie, topped with cheddar. Yes, it’s a main dish, not a dessert. It has often appeared for my birthday.
That sounds lovely! I might try it out.
I'm not nostalgic for my mother's puddings; my husband makes far better ones. I like and appreciate good quality food, regardless of whether it is familiar or not. And if I'm paying for it that is what I expect.
I think eating for nostalgia runs the risk of being disappointed.
Lots of us are perfectly capable of appreciating good home baking, including our mothers’ or grandmothers’ (or fathers’) home baking, and well done baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home. It’s not either/or. Sometimes we want and prefer the familiar. Sometimes we want and expect the special.
I would be delighted if this thread had evidence of "lots of us" indicating interest in "baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home."
Regrettably I have not had the opportunity to find out in person, with this particular dessert. I expect it would be similar to any other puddle-and-drizzle serving: You take a bit of the creme brulee (sorry don't know how to do accents on keyboard), dip it into some of the sauce, then dip it into some of the powder, then consume. Repeat.
Lots of us are perfectly capable of appreciating good home baking, including our mothers’ or grandmothers’ (or fathers’) home baking, and well done baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home. It’s not either/or. Sometimes we want and prefer the familiar. Sometimes we want and expect the special.
I would be delighted if this thread had evidence of "lots of us" indicating interest in "baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home."
It would be lovely if people on this thread expressed interest in what constitutes quality dessert as marketed, produced, and consumed in restaurants.
This is Hell, and Hell isn't here to be lovely or to give you thrills.
No right-thinking gourmand wants to eat something that is 'marketed' before it is 'produced,' and is 'produced' at all, and not confected, and is 'consumed,' and not nibbled or devoured. The foodstuff in the video you linked is banal and unappetizing, and I hope the people sitting around that table were paid to be there.
This evening I'm going to have a slice of delicious apple empanada, in the Galician style, made with apples from my garden, lime juice, and brown sugar, and encased in a thin, crisp, flaky, egg and oil pastry. Bite me.
(Hugal! I see you've got your fists up to fight anyone who raises an eyebrow at your burnt cream recipe. Is there another--ideally a Cambridge--pâtissier willing to oblige him with a quarrel?)
The Gogs are little, but they're the tail end of the Chilterns, and so determine the local weather.
"Dessert as performance art" = the pointless parting of fools from way too much of their money. Sorry that I didn't realize that by "high quality" you meant pretentious stuff that has more to do with the egos of the self-proclaimed cognoscenti than it does food.
I've heard of couli, no idea what it actually is. Do I need to know?
A coulis is a strained fruit (usually) puree, used as a thin sauce, typically drizzled over your cheesecake (or whatever).
I'm always reminded of the (incredibly politically incorrect) Two Fat Ladies on this one. I can't remember which of them it was, but she remarked "Don't, for goodness sake, call it a coulis. A coolie is a Chinese gentleman in a triangular straw hat." And then, realising this might not be well received, she added "And jolly good chaps they are too!"
I've never been able to hear 'coulis' with a straight face since.
I have had deconstructed desserts in posh restaurants, and occasionally eaten in Michelin starred restaurants - and I still like no bake cheese cake with jam.
That said I did once have a rather fine dessert of custard stuff with sweet bits in a sealed jar containing smoke - can’t remember what it was called.
"Dessert as performance art" = the pointless parting of fools from way too much of their money. Sorry that I didn't realize that by "high quality" you meant pretentious stuff that has more to do with the egos of the self-proclaimed cognoscenti than it does food.
It depends on how well it is done and which desserts are involved. Live plating (to give it its proper name) is a round in The Great British Bake Off Professionals. It is much better in there.
Burnt Cream and Creme Brûlée are slightly different though very similar. Burnt Cream need not have the sugar crack, Creme Brûlée does.
As to the nostalgia. Well yes and no. My mum was not a good cook neither was my dad, that is one of the reasons I learnt to cook. Do you approach the main course menu with the same amount of sentimentality? I would say most people don’t. Quality and time taken speak which ever course.
This thread shows why quality desserts are neither sought nor paid for.
People (in this thread) don't want high quality. They want nostalgia. They remember sweets their moms used to make. Unless their mothers were exceptionally capable home bakers, the vast majority of these will be pretty run-of-the-mill. So why would they pursue and pay for culinary achievement?
I don’t buy that. Or as we would say here, that dog won’t hunt.
Lots of us are perfectly capable of appreciating good home baking, including our mothers’ or grandmothers’ (or fathers’) home baking, and well done baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home. It’s not either/or. Sometimes we want and prefer the familiar. Sometimes we want and expect the special.
By your theory, we’d all prefer the nostalgia of all the food we grew up on, and no restaurants would bother with anything other than the run-of-the-mill we could just as easily cook at home. It’s not the simple.
I don't think Leaf was trying to imply that familiarity was the only driver, but is sure as hell is one of the main ones. It the the reason regional cuisine is a thing, why ethnic neighbourhoods are more densely populated by ethnic cuisine and why McDonalds are in nearly every bloody tourist spot.
"Dessert as performance art" = the pointless parting of fools from way too much of their money. Sorry that I didn't realize that by "high quality" you meant pretentious stuff that has more to do with the egos of the self-proclaimed cognoscenti than it does food.
This statement is itself, snobbery. Whilst I agree that there is often a fools and their money aspect to fine dining, there can also be serious exploration of taste, texture and presentation.
I've never been served Burnt Cream that didn't have the well-named sugar crack on top. Impressed by the esoteric knowledge of the Craft.
To all intents and purposes they are the same now.
We tend to call it Creme Brûlée in the UK. Despite Burnt Cream coming from these shores.
It is a similar argument to the method of making Champagne. Many will argue that the method was first used in the UK and that the French discovered the method later and claimed it as their own. The same for Burnt Cream
We've just had lunch Out. The dessert was described as 'Pornstar Martini Eton Mess' - actually some sort of diced fruit - possibly mango - in cream and meringue and a smidgen of vodka.
That and the Apple Snow I made last night have used up my whipped cream entitlement for the next six months.
On the nostalgia front, I can't honestly think of any childhood food I'd pine for, or which I couldn't do as well or better if I did.
This is Hell, and Hell isn't here to be lovely or to give you thrills.
No right-thinking gourmand wants to eat something that is 'marketed' before it is 'produced,' and is 'produced' at all, and not confected, and is 'consumed,' and not nibbled or devoured. The foodstuff in the video you linked is banal and unappetizing, and I hope the people sitting around that table were paid to be there.
Awesome! Yes! Now this is what I come to Hell for. Thank you!
It would have to be a self-deluding gourmand to imagine that marketing is not a factor in the desserts in the restaurant industry, which is what I thought we were talking about. Produced: well, somebody has to make it, and produced does not mean industrial manufacture. I deliberately chose flat, robotic language ("consume, repeat") rather than the rapturous style employed by the creative writing department of dessert marketing, because I felt like it.
This evening I'm going to have a slice of delicious apple empanada, in the Galician style, made with apples from my garden, lime juice, and brown sugar, and encased in a thin, crisp, flaky, egg and oil pastry. Bite me.
Depending on the amount of lime juice used, you might be too acidic.
Lots of us are perfectly capable of appreciating good home baking, including our mothers’ or grandmothers’ (or fathers’) home baking, and well done baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home. It’s not either/or. Sometimes we want and prefer the familiar. Sometimes we want and expect the special.
I would be delighted if this thread had evidence of "lots of us" indicating interest in "baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home."
I love the performance aspect of it and following what they laid out, I think it potentially taste very good. However taste, for me, is paramount. I've had too many expensive presentations that were disappointing to the tongue.
It would be lovely if people on this thread expressed interest in what constitutes quality dessert as marketed, produced, and consumed in restaurants.
Quality begins with the ingredients, followed by the preparation. Presentation is the least important to me, but it is not irrelevant. I think both ingredients and preparation are where most restaurants fall short. Concessions to cost and ease lead to choices that diminish the result.
Lots of us are perfectly capable of appreciating good home baking, including our mothers’ or grandmothers’ (or fathers’) home baking, and well done baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home. It’s not either/or. Sometimes we want and prefer the familiar. Sometimes we want and expect the special.
I would be delighted if this thread had evidence of "lots of us" indicating interest in "baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home."
It would be lovely if people on this thread expressed interest in what constitutes quality dessert as marketed, produced, and consumed in restaurants.
This is Hell, and Hell isn't here to be lovely or to give you thrills.
No right-thinking gourmand wants to eat something that is 'marketed' before it is 'produced,' and is 'produced' at all, and not confected, and is 'consumed,' and not nibbled or devoured. The foodstuff in the video you linked is banal and unappetizing, and I hope the people sitting around that table were paid to be there.
This evening I'm going to have a slice of delicious apple empanada, in the Galician style, made with apples from my garden, lime juice, and brown sugar, and encased in a thin, crisp, flaky, egg and oil pastry. Bite me.
(Hugal! I see you've got your fists up to fight anyone who raises an eyebrow at your burnt cream recipe. Is there another--ideally a Cambridge--pâtissier willing to oblige him with a quarrel?)
The Gogs are little, but they're the tail end of the Chilterns, and so determine the local weather.
"Dessert as performance art" = the pointless parting of fools from way too much of their money. Sorry that I didn't realize that by "high quality" you meant pretentious stuff that has more to do with the egos of the self-proclaimed cognoscenti than it does food.
I did not refer to "high quality". I referred to one possible use of presentation, live plating (thank you for the term, Hugal). I don't think live plating = high quality, necessarily. Nor do I look down on people with different ideas about what constitutes high quality in restaurant desserts. Based on your response, I think you might, though.
This thread shows why quality desserts are neither sought nor paid for.
People (in this thread) don't want high quality. They want nostalgia. They remember sweets their moms used to make. Unless their mothers were exceptionally capable home bakers, the vast majority of these will be pretty run-of-the-mill. So why would they pursue and pay for culinary achievement?
I don’t buy that. Or as we would say here, that dog won’t hunt.
Lots of us are perfectly capable of appreciating good home baking, including our mothers’ or grandmothers’ (or fathers’) home baking, and well done baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home. It’s not either/or. Sometimes we want and prefer the familiar. Sometimes we want and expect the special.
By your theory, we’d all prefer the nostalgia of all the food we grew up on, and no restaurants would bother with anything other than the run-of-the-mill we could just as easily cook at home. It’s not the simple.
"Dessert as performance art" = the pointless parting of fools from way too much of their money. Sorry that I didn't realize that by "high quality" you meant pretentious stuff that has more to do with the egos of the self-proclaimed cognoscenti than it does food.
This statement is itself, snobbery.
If you want to read it that way, fine by me. I might say counter-snobbery, but to-may-to, to-mah-to.
"Dessert as performance art" = the pointless parting of fools from way too much of their money. Sorry that I didn't realize that by "high quality" you meant pretentious stuff that has more to do with the egos of the self-proclaimed cognoscenti than it does food.
I did not refer to "high quality". I referred to one possible use of presentation, live plating (thank you for the term, Hugal). I don't think live plating = high quality, necessarily. Nor do I look down on people with different ideas about what constitutes high quality in restaurant desserts. Based on your response, I think you might, though.
This thread shows why quality desserts are neither sought nor paid for.
People (in this thread) don't want high quality. They want nostalgia.
And no, I actually don’t look down on different tastes. I’ve been clear many times that I don’t share the tastes of lots of people, and that’s fine. I’ve described that showing how I’m weird.
What I’m reacting against is the idea you posited that just because people in this thread have talked about home desserts they like, they therefor don’t like or have ignored “high quality” desserts, hence the problem set forth in the OP. I don’t buy that either/or premise.
If people in general wanted high quality desserts, there wouldn't be so many mediocre and crap ones.
Most people are satisfied with a quantity of sugar and fat with a little flavour added.
That video reminded me of a childhood instruction "Don't play with your food". And also reminded me of the deeply disappointing trifle I had in Leicestershire, where the important word "deconstructed" was omitted somewhere. So the cakey juicy bit was in one place, with the fruit separately next door, and the custard, and the cream likewise. I can't remember the details exactly - was the custard sort of solid? It passed the trifle test of not being Birds, but since trifle, in my view, depends on getting the parts messed together during eating, deconstructed it isn't trifle.
What I’m reacting against is the idea you posited that just because people in this thread have talked about home desserts they like, they therefor don’t like or have ignored “high quality” desserts, hence the problem set forth in the OP. I don’t buy that either/or premise.
Let me express myself more precisely:
People (in this thread) don't want to discuss what constitutes high quality restaurant desserts . They want to talk about their nostalgia for homemade desserts.
That was why I expressed my interest in discussing different aspects of what "high quality" restaurant dessert means. lilbuddha got it, and talked about ingredients, preparation, and presentation of restaurant desserts.
I don't think it's an either/or premise. But it may be an either/or conversation, so to speak.
High quality ingredients, for starters. I could probably tell the difference between good and bad ingredients. I may sometimes be able to tell the difference between good and excellent ingredients. What I doubt is my ability to distinguish between excellent and sublime ingredients. That is where either finer palates than mine can distinguish subtleties (good faith) or I can suspect I'm being sold a load of bullshit (bad faith).
Take chocolate. I can separate good and bad chocolate easily enough. I'm confident I can distinguish between good and excellent chocolate. But between excellent and sublime chocolate, I'm not sure I can make that fine a distinction that would warrant paying for sublime chocolate. Single-plantation cacao beans do not, for my taste, merit the kind of distinction and costs involved with, analoguously, single-malt Scotch. So is chocolate made with single-plantation cacao beans truly sublime or is it merely marketing bullshit? I don't know, so I wouldn't seek it out nor pay the price. That may only speak to the limitations of my palate.
What I’m reacting against is the idea you posited that just because people in this thread have talked about home desserts they like, they therefor don’t like or have ignored “high quality” desserts, hence the problem set forth in the OP. I don’t buy that either/or premise.
Let me express myself more precisely:
People (in this thread) don't want to discuss what constitutes high quality restaurant desserts . They want to talk about their nostalgia for homemade desserts.
That’s because this is a Hell thread. It doesn’t exist for discussion. It exists for complaining and ranting—in this case about why (restaurant) desserts are so often awful. That said, I think a fair amount of complaining and ranting in this thread has included comments as to what does and doesn’t make a high quality dessert, whether in a restaurant or at home. To read that as primarily about nostalgia is, I think, to misread what many have said or to infer what may not be intended.
If what you want is actual discussion on what factors make a dessert one of high quality, a thread for that purpose somewhere other than Hell might be more productive.
These are dark times - but at least tapioca puddings seem to have passed from the earth. That and sago.
You can see why we fell on Angel Delight - it came in flavours! And didn't have the texture of frogspawn.
And then yogurts!
I can totally see why we have gone over to little tubs of fluff or gloop.
Then there was semolina, which makes tapioca and sago seem good.
It's bizarre, isn't it? Drag a plant product halfway around the world to make a pudding no-one likes to ruin the day of decades of schoolkids. You'd think it grew naturally in the Thames Valley...
I think one thing both home made and restaurant made have in common is that you can taste the love in them. Yes that is not very Hellish, though it might be for some readers. Let me explain.
Both the family cook and the restraint pastry chef do it for love, it is certainly not for the money. A mother (father) makes nice things for the family because they love the family. A pastry chef makes great desserts because he/she loves to make great desserts for customers. That effect and joy somehow get into the food. Factory ace desserts no matter how good can not match that.
Tell me if you disagree
Comments
My Old Mum made a most wonderful Apple-and-Blackberry PIE, the fruit from her own garden (mostly). The pastry used up illegal amounts of BUTTER...
I very much doubt if such a PIE could be purchased today at any eatery, anywhere.
I haven't made a pie for years, on account of the calories, the cholesterol, and the gluten intolerance of Mr Nen. When it is just the two of us we hardly ever have dessert at home - hence it's such a treat when we go out. If there's a choice, I'll always have mains and dessert rather than starter and mains. Last time we went out I had an amazing dessert of chocolate fudge brownie, hazelnut purée and vanilla ice cream.
My go-to dessert at home when we Have Company is strawberries and blueberries with cream, ice cream or fromage frais. Sometimes I go wild and throw in a meringue nest as well.
I’m currently mourning the closing of a long-time cafeteria here. It was an institution, but it couldn’t survive COVID. One of my favorite things on their menu was the buttered coconut pie. Heaven on a plate.
Pecan pie is actually the prime example to me of how restaurant desserts can be really good or really bad. A good pecan pie is divine. A bad one, on the other hand, is a huge disappointment at the loss of what could have been.
People (in this thread) don't want high quality. They want nostalgia. They remember sweets their moms used to make. Unless their mothers were exceptionally capable home bakers, the vast majority of these will be pretty run-of-the-mill. So why would they pursue and pay for culinary achievement?
(with apologies to L P Hartley)
But, yes, most people do not have a reference for quality food. Otherwise McDonald's and Greggs would not be as popular as they are.
No, dear, a la mode is how the Baby Jesus and his Blessed Mother prefer theirs.
Although they also enjoy apple pie with a slice of a nice Cheddar on top.
Ewwww....
That and the Apple Snow I made last night have used up my whipped cream entitlement for the next six months.
On the nostalgia front, I can't honestly think of any childhood food I'd pine for, or which I couldn't do as well or better if I did.
Lots of us are perfectly capable of appreciating good home baking, including our mothers’ or grandmothers’ (or fathers’) home baking, and well done baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home. It’s not either/or. Sometimes we want and prefer the familiar. Sometimes we want and expect the special.
By your theory, we’d all prefer the nostalgia of all the food we grew up on, and no restaurants would bother with anything other than the run-of-the-mill we could just as easily cook at home. It’s not the simple.
That sounds lovely! I might try it out.
I'm not nostalgic for my mother's puddings; my husband makes far better ones. I like and appreciate good quality food, regardless of whether it is familiar or not. And if I'm paying for it that is what I expect.
I think eating for nostalgia runs the risk of being disappointed.
I would be delighted if this thread had evidence of "lots of us" indicating interest in "baking and patisserie that most people could never attempt at home."
I would be thrilled if anyone took the opportunity to discuss dessert as performance art, such as this classic from Alinea: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qofsdSMuGbg .
It would be lovely if people on this thread expressed interest in what constitutes quality dessert as marketed, produced, and consumed in restaurants.
Regrettably I have not had the opportunity to find out in person, with this particular dessert. I expect it would be similar to any other puddle-and-drizzle serving: You take a bit of the creme brulee (sorry don't know how to do accents on keyboard), dip it into some of the sauce, then dip it into some of the powder, then consume. Repeat.
This is Hell, and Hell isn't here to be lovely or to give you thrills.
No right-thinking gourmand wants to eat something that is 'marketed' before it is 'produced,' and is 'produced' at all, and not confected, and is 'consumed,' and not nibbled or devoured. The foodstuff in the video you linked is banal and unappetizing, and I hope the people sitting around that table were paid to be there.
This evening I'm going to have a slice of delicious apple empanada, in the Galician style, made with apples from my garden, lime juice, and brown sugar, and encased in a thin, crisp, flaky, egg and oil pastry. Bite me.
(Hugal! I see you've got your fists up to fight anyone who raises an eyebrow at your burnt cream recipe. Is there another--ideally a Cambridge--pâtissier willing to oblige him with a quarrel?)
The Gogs are little, but they're the tail end of the Chilterns, and so determine the local weather.
Heresy. They who serve lemon meringue pie a la mode can burn in the sixth circle of Hell with the other blaphemers.
I'm always reminded of the (incredibly politically incorrect) Two Fat Ladies on this one. I can't remember which of them it was, but she remarked "Don't, for goodness sake, call it a coulis. A coolie is a Chinese gentleman in a triangular straw hat." And then, realising this might not be well received, she added "And jolly good chaps they are too!"
I've never been able to hear 'coulis' with a straight face since.
That said I did once have a rather fine dessert of custard stuff with sweet bits in a sealed jar containing smoke - can’t remember what it was called.
It depends on how well it is done and which desserts are involved. Live plating (to give it its proper name) is a round in The Great British Bake Off Professionals. It is much better in there.
Burnt Cream and Creme Brûlée are slightly different though very similar. Burnt Cream need not have the sugar crack, Creme Brûlée does.
As to the nostalgia. Well yes and no. My mum was not a good cook neither was my dad, that is one of the reasons I learnt to cook. Do you approach the main course menu with the same amount of sentimentality? I would say most people don’t. Quality and time taken speak which ever course.
On a shop-bought flan case with bananas sliced into it, top with the butterscotch Angel Delight and crumble a chocolate flake over the top.
We tend to call it Creme Brûlée in the UK. Despite Burnt Cream coming from these shores.
It is a similar argument to the method of making Champagne. Many will argue that the method was first used in the UK and that the French discovered the method later and claimed it as their own. The same for Burnt Cream
Dear Lord.....
*shudders
Fresh warm chocolate chip cookies ..
Awesome! Yes! Now this is what I come to Hell for. Thank you!
It would have to be a self-deluding gourmand to imagine that marketing is not a factor in the desserts in the restaurant industry, which is what I thought we were talking about. Produced: well, somebody has to make it, and produced does not mean industrial manufacture. I deliberately chose flat, robotic language ("consume, repeat") rather than the rapturous style employed by the creative writing department of dessert marketing, because I felt like it.
Depending on the amount of lime juice used, you might be too acidic.
Quality begins with the ingredients, followed by the preparation. Presentation is the least important to me, but it is not irrelevant. I think both ingredients and preparation are where most restaurants fall short. Concessions to cost and ease lead to choices that diminish the result.
Surly you mean an apple turnover
I did not refer to "high quality". I referred to one possible use of presentation, live plating (thank you for the term, Hugal). I don't think live plating = high quality, necessarily. Nor do I look down on people with different ideas about what constitutes high quality in restaurant desserts. Based on your response, I think you might, though.
If you want to read it that way, fine by me. I might say counter-snobbery, but to-may-to, to-mah-to.
You did indeed refer to high quality: And no, I actually don’t look down on different tastes. I’ve been clear many times that I don’t share the tastes of lots of people, and that’s fine. I’ve described that showing how I’m weird.
What I’m reacting against is the idea you posited that just because people in this thread have talked about home desserts they like, they therefor don’t like or have ignored “high quality” desserts, hence the problem set forth in the OP. I don’t buy that either/or premise.
Most people are satisfied with a quantity of sugar and fat with a little flavour added.
Let me express myself more precisely:
People (in this thread) don't want to discuss what constitutes high quality restaurant desserts . They want to talk about their nostalgia for homemade desserts.
That was why I expressed my interest in discussing different aspects of what "high quality" restaurant dessert means. lilbuddha got it, and talked about ingredients, preparation, and presentation of restaurant desserts.
I don't think it's an either/or premise. But it may be an either/or conversation, so to speak.
Take chocolate. I can separate good and bad chocolate easily enough. I'm confident I can distinguish between good and excellent chocolate. But between excellent and sublime chocolate, I'm not sure I can make that fine a distinction that would warrant paying for sublime chocolate. Single-plantation cacao beans do not, for my taste, merit the kind of distinction and costs involved with, analoguously, single-malt Scotch. So is chocolate made with single-plantation cacao beans truly sublime or is it merely marketing bullshit? I don't know, so I wouldn't seek it out nor pay the price. That may only speak to the limitations of my palate.
That’s because this is a Hell thread. It doesn’t exist for discussion. It exists for complaining and ranting—in this case about why (restaurant) desserts are so often awful. That said, I think a fair amount of complaining and ranting in this thread has included comments as to what does and doesn’t make a high quality dessert, whether in a restaurant or at home. To read that as primarily about nostalgia is, I think, to misread what many have said or to infer what may not be intended.
If what you want is actual discussion on what factors make a dessert one of high quality, a thread for that purpose somewhere other than Hell might be more productive.
You can see why we fell on Angel Delight - it came in flavours! And didn't have the texture of frogspawn.
And then yogurts!
I can totally see why we have gone over to little tubs of fluff or gloop.
Then there was semolina, which makes tapioca and sago seem good.
It's bizarre, isn't it? Drag a plant product halfway around the world to make a pudding no-one likes to ruin the day of decades of schoolkids. You'd think it grew naturally in the Thames Valley...
Both the family cook and the restraint pastry chef do it for love, it is certainly not for the money. A mother (father) makes nice things for the family because they love the family. A pastry chef makes great desserts because he/she loves to make great desserts for customers. That effect and joy somehow get into the food. Factory ace desserts no matter how good can not match that.
Tell me if you disagree