There's a lot of concern in American media that Biden won't get the full transition experience, thanks to Trump's sulks. While I appreciate a handover is useful, from an outside perspective it seems like a luxury. In the UK one PM goes, and another starts at once. What happens in other countries?
In a normal transition, it would be bad enough as there is loads to be aware of and decisions to be made and those don't stop coming, so the catching up is spread over a longer time. But I am fairly sure that Trump never fully completed his own presidency. As I recall, he never filled all the offices he was supposed to. And he has staffed many offices with loyalists who will all have to be evaluated and replaced. And the people they appointed/hired will have to be evaluated and potentially replaced.
This was going to be a tougher transition than normal even if the bastard had cooperated.
Heard someone on NPR say that it was a factor in 9/11. Evidently, there was a delayed transition between Clinton and Bush 43. (That seems vaguely familiar, but I don't remember it.) The 9/11 commission said that delay was a factor in the new administration not getting up to speed on terrorism dangers, and thus not catching on to what was developing.
Heard someone on NPR say that it was a factor in 9/11. Evidently, there was a delayed transition between Clinton and Bush 43. (That seems vaguely familiar, but I don't remember it.) The 9/11 commission said that delay was a factor in the new administration not getting up to speed on terrorism dangers, and thus not catching on to what was developing.
The deal of it is the Bush administration had retained the Clinton counterterrorism expert and he did warn Bush on 9/10 that all indications were that there was a pending attack. Bush reportedly thanked him for the warning and then went fishing! Bush did not raise the alert status until after the fact on 9/11.
I kind of have a feeling (based on nothing) that he may not return to Washington after Christmas in Florida, or that he may leave some time in early January (still not conceding!). His stuff will be packed up by whoever does those things normally -- hopefully in time for a thorough cleaning, disinfecting, and "de-bugging" of the entire White House.
In one sense, I suppose it ends in January, when President Biden takes over, no matter what Trump and his supporters might say or do to the contrary. The current lawsuits appear mostly to be dead in the water, anyway.
As to further lawsuits, there's an item on the BBC website about the half-dozen quite nasty legal actions awaiting Trump once he becomes a private citizen again.
As an outsider looking in ..... how does this handover business end tho?
Is it waiting until the lawsuits run out of steam?
Transition by boredom?
I looked it up. and it seems that 20 January is the official date. The custom has been to begin the transition within a day or is of the election. However, there is nothing mandating that the loser has to help, as far as I am aware
I looked it up. and it seems that 20 January is the official date. The custom has been to begin the transition within a day or is of the election. However, there is nothing mandating that the loser has to help, as far as I am aware
The loser of the election, personally and specifically, isn't required to help. There are, however, several legal requirements of various government agencies that still answer to Trump. For example:
A Trump administration appointee is refusing to sign a letter allowing President-elect Joe Biden’s transition team to formally begin its work this week, in another sign the incumbent president has not acknowledged Biden’s victory and could disrupt the transfer of power.
The administrator of the General Services Administration, the low-profile agency in charge of federal buildings, has a little-known role when a new president is elected: to sign paperwork officially turning over millions of dollars, as well as give access to government officials, office space in agencies and equipment authorized for the taxpayer-funded transition teams of the winner.
It amounts to a formal declaration by the federal government, outside of the media, of the winner of the presidential race.
But by Sunday evening, almost 36 hours after media outlets projected Biden as the winner, GSA Administrator Emily Murphy had written no such letter. And the Trump administration, in keeping with the president’s failure to concede the election, has no immediate plans to sign one. This could lead to the first transition delay in modern history, except in 2000, when the Supreme Court decided a recount dispute between Al Gore and George W. Bush in December.
That article was written eight days ago. As of today, Emily Murphy still has not signed that letter or released those transition funds.
President-elect Biden has also not started receiving the Presidential Daily Briefing from the intelligence community, nor has he been allowed any contact with (or briefing by) the coronavirus task force.
Here’s another little thing to keep an eye on, in the context of the looting that’s undoubtedly taking place right now all over the Trump administration:
The Former Presidents Act, provides, among other things, that former presidents can rent office space at taxpayer expense after leaving office (This is a terrible law, which ought to be revoked or significantly reformed, but that’s a discussion for another day).
The way this gets negotiated is that in their last days in office former presidents submit requests to the GSA regarding suitable space, and this creates the baseline for annual requests going forward. (The FPA specifically allows the rented space to be privately owned).
Currently there’s an informal understanding that it’s OK for a former president to spend around a half million per year renting office space at taxpayer expense. Figures for FY2019: Clinton $513K, GWB, $500K, Obama, $542K (Again this is absurd, but leave that aside for the moment. Typically, Jimmy Carter is spending only $117K on office space).
Hey, I wonder who will be the landlord taking in the rent for Donald Trump’s taxpayer-provided post-presidential offices, and what that rent will be? I bet you can come up with some creative guesses as to exactly what cosy little arrangement Emily Murphy is going to approve, before she’s scuttles off to whatever wingnut welfare sinecure will offer her shelter from the storm.
As far as the (non) transition goes, I'm just glad that this won't be Biden's first rodeo. He's had experience with transitions from both sides, and is probably best placed to make up for lost time of anybody we could have had. A first-timer would have been adrift.
As far as the (non) transition goes, I'm just glad that this won't be Biden's first rodeo. He's had experience with transitions from both sides, and is probably best placed to make up for lost time of anybody we could have had. A first-timer would have been adrift.
I've thought the same thing, Lamb Chopped. (He also has a close relationship with Trump's predecessor, which will be a big help.)
I am wondering if Biden might get the Federal Courts to compel the Trump administration to participate in a transition.
He might be waiting for the necessary number of states to certify their results. At the latest that would be December 8. In the meantime try to get Republican senators to put pressure on the White House (Biden's other advantage is he does know the Senate) so they don't have to go that route.
I suspect he's waiting for the electoral college to do its Thang on Dec 14*, which will basically wipe out any before-going shenanigans about vote recounts and the like. Up to that point, he can let mere pressure of time and worldwide opinion do their work. Indeed, the longer Trump behaves as he is doing, the more discredited he will be in the eyes of anybody not wholly enslaved to his cult--which could be a boon to the new administration as they try to pick up the pieces.
* to be sure, they aren't officially counted on that day, but on January 6. But from all I can remember, they are known then.
I am not privavy to the minds or machinations of the Republican senators, but the Georgia runoffs don't happen until Jan 5. Do not expect to see any Republican cooperation until after the last vote is cast and counted.
I do very much hope that one of the early priorities of the incoming administration will be to codify/convince Congress to codify, whatever, the norms around presidential elections--such as when the GSLA MUST begin working with the new administration, regardless of the old one's desires. And probably work with the states to clean up the issues around faithless electors, which are only half-completed. I am weary of this foolishness.
Evidently, there was a delayed transition between Clinton and Bush 43. (That seems vaguely familiar, but I don't remember it.)
That delayed transition included hanging chads and recounts in the decisive state of Florida, which prevented knowing whether Bush or Gore had a majority of electoral votes until a SCOTUS decision on December 12, 2000.
I think maybe it's the General Services Administration, or some facet thereof. That's the place that should be shelling out transition money to Joe & Co.
I do very much hope that one of the early priorities of the incoming administration will be to codify/convince Congress to codify, whatever, the norms around presidential elections--such as when the GSLA MUST begin working with the new administration, regardless of the old one's desires. And probably work with the states to clean up the issues around faithless electors, which are only half-completed. I am weary of this foolishness.
If the Senate remains republican, that will not happen. If the Senate flips...it still won't happen.
The sloppy nature is a feature, not a bug, as far as legislators are concerned. It is only "bad" when being used against one's position.
If the Senate remains republican, that will not happen. If the Senate flips...it still won't happen.
The sloppy nature is a feature, not a bug, as far as legislators are concerned. It is only "bad" when being used against one's position.
It should be noted that regardless of what happens in the Georgia special elections the Senate will still be controlled by Republicans when Congress meets to certify the electoral votes on January 6. Even if we assume that Ossoff and Warnock win their elections on January 5 in such a decisive manner that they can both be sworn in the next day, the Senate will still be divided 50/50 and the tie-breaking vote will be . . . Mike Pence, whose term as vice president doesn't end until January 20.
Barnabas62Purgatory Host, 8th Day Host, Epiphanies Host
Well, there's a thing. Yet another Hail Mary. Except ... doesn't a refusal to confirm mean that Trump and Pence are out, Joe and Kamala are out, and Nancy Pelosi gets the job? I think I read that somewhere. There are some pretty arcane contingency provisions in this process.
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This was going to be a tougher transition than normal even if the bastard had cooperated.
Prior to 1937, new US Presidents were not inaugurated until March 4 of the year following the election, so the overlap used to be bigger.
Heard someone on NPR say that it was a factor in 9/11. Evidently, there was a delayed transition between Clinton and Bush 43. (That seems vaguely familiar, but I don't remember it.) The 9/11 commission said that delay was a factor in the new administration not getting up to speed on terrorism dangers, and thus not catching on to what was developing.
As one twitter user put it:
The deal of it is the Bush administration had retained the Clinton counterterrorism expert and he did warn Bush on 9/10 that all indications were that there was a pending attack. Bush reportedly thanked him for the warning and then went fishing! Bush did not raise the alert status until after the fact on 9/11.
I really think we should avoid driving on that road as my beloved gets frightfully cross then his driving standards dip just a little
But yes, alert the borders!
Is it waiting until the lawsuits run out of steam?
Transition by boredom?
As to further lawsuits, there's an item on the BBC website about the half-dozen quite nasty legal actions awaiting Trump once he becomes a private citizen again.
The loser of the election, personally and specifically, isn't required to help. There are, however, several legal requirements of various government agencies that still answer to Trump. For example:
That article was written eight days ago. As of today, Emily Murphy still has not signed that letter or released those transition funds.
President-elect Biden has also not started receiving the Presidential Daily Briefing from the intelligence community, nor has he been allowed any contact with (or briefing by) the coronavirus task force.
Over at Lawyers, Guns, and Money, Paul Campos connects a few interesting dots about this GSA saga.
Wheels within wheels.
I've thought the same thing, Lamb Chopped. (He also has a close relationship with Trump's predecessor, which will be a big help.)
* to be sure, they aren't officially counted on that day, but on January 6. But from all I can remember, they are known then.
Thx. Knew that; but, somehow, I wasn't connecting that with "transition period".
I think maybe it's the General Services Administration, or some facet thereof. That's the place that should be shelling out transition money to Joe & Co.
The sloppy nature is a feature, not a bug, as far as legislators are concerned. It is only "bad" when being used against one's position.
It should be noted that regardless of what happens in the Georgia special elections the Senate will still be controlled by Republicans when Congress meets to certify the electoral votes on January 6. Even if we assume that Ossoff and Warnock win their elections on January 5 in such a decisive manner that they can both be sworn in the next day, the Senate will still be divided 50/50 and the tie-breaking vote will be . . . Mike Pence, whose term as vice president doesn't end until January 20.
I admit part of me hope that happens. Even if Nancy Pelosi is only president for a day, while things are getting sorted out.
https://tinyurl.com/y4ou3wyq
Boy, it said at the credits that this guy is a comedy writer. This was almost too close to reality to be comedy.
:applause:
That is AWESOME!
:happydance:
Thx for the link, Croesos!!!
Yes, I know.
Anyway, it made this Host’s day!