The Prophecy of The Popes
undead_rat
Shipmate
Also known as the Prophecy of St. Malachy, but O'Brien proved that Malachy did not make it. Its true author was Fr. Arnold Wion who published a list of 113 papal predictions in 1595.
The attribution to St. Malachy appears to have been a ruse to allow Wion to avoid prosecution by the Roman Inquisition. (In Catholic theology prophecy ended with the Book of Revelation, and any subsequent end of the world prophecy is heretical.)
The second issue is that an altered list was reprinted by Fr. Messingham in 1624 in his History of the Irish Saints, and this list was shortened to just 112 predictions. This editing may not have made much difference in 1624, but now that we are at number 112 for Pope Francis, it makes a crucial difference. Prediction number 113 names the last pope as "Petrus Romanus," and Francis clearly has no connection to that title. Number 112 which is the one that applies to him.
It reads:
In psecutione. extrema S.R.E. sedebit.
The correct translation is: "He will reign in the final persecution. of the Holy Roman Church."
This is an ominous prediction, and it remains to be seem if it will come true.
[edited to remove all-caps title - Alan Cresswell]
The attribution to St. Malachy appears to have been a ruse to allow Wion to avoid prosecution by the Roman Inquisition. (In Catholic theology prophecy ended with the Book of Revelation, and any subsequent end of the world prophecy is heretical.)
The second issue is that an altered list was reprinted by Fr. Messingham in 1624 in his History of the Irish Saints, and this list was shortened to just 112 predictions. This editing may not have made much difference in 1624, but now that we are at number 112 for Pope Francis, it makes a crucial difference. Prediction number 113 names the last pope as "Petrus Romanus," and Francis clearly has no connection to that title. Number 112 which is the one that applies to him.
It reads:
In psecutione. extrema S.R.E. sedebit.
The correct translation is: "He will reign in the final persecution. of the Holy Roman Church."
This is an ominous prediction, and it remains to be seem if it will come true.
[edited to remove all-caps title - Alan Cresswell]
Comments
(Please could a kindly Host stop the thread title from shouting?)
(I mean, that's what's being predicted here, right? Or does "the final persecution of The Holy Roman Church" mean the RCC will be persecuted by some external force? Either way, some variation on "The shit's really gonna hit the fan with the next Pontiff".)
If memory serves it's really good on the ones between its alleged date of writing and date of "discovery" but kind of shit after that. But maybe I'm thinking of a different false prophecy.
Maybe we should, though?
YMMV.
Perspicacious as ever...
That's the great thing about Catholicism. Its so vague and nobody really knows what its all about.
As a former barking rabid Whore and Her Daughters anti-catholic, what?
(Camry OTA posted a Father Ted quote, and I followed with my own).
Why?
Interesting how these things go. AIUI, there were only supposed to be 13 Dalai Lamas in the current lineage--but the current is the *14th*.
Though the current one has suggested he may be the last.
I don't think that the Catholic church teaches that the Bible is "error-free", at least not in the way that the term "error-free" is usually understood in discussions about the Bible today.
Nor do I think the 10 Commandments play quite the central role in RC theology that he thinks they do.
The writer of that article seems to think that Catholics are something like uber-fundamentalists, probably because they're known to be a conservative church, and conservatism and fundamentalism are often assumed to be synonymous by hoi poloi.
Yes (Wikipedia). Per him, it's up to the Tibetan people. There could be a woman DL. The Chinese gov't might interfere intervene, and make their own choice. (Like they did with the Panchen Lama.)
Until recently I believed without question that the anticipated resignation of Pope Francis (who may yet turn out to be Peter the Roman) in 2020 would fulfill a 900-year-old prophecy and usher in the End Times. Like everything else about 2020, that was another non-event.
Unless you read The Nice and Accurate Prophecies of Agnes Nutter, Witch- all her prophecies were entirely correct. See Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman's Good Omens.
Aye, I was demonstrating that it's easy to come up with 'what it's all about'. And I totally agree it's a second rate definition. It was the source name I went for.
IMHO, Nostradamus was a cagey old* coot who didn't want to be burnt at the stake, etc. Hence cryptic.
*Not all that old, IIRC; but he fits the stereotype.
The popes have been removed from Rome several times notably during the Babylonian Schism as well as during the Napoleonic times. the city has 'apostasised' during the Roman Republic in 1848 and again some would have said in 1870 with the breach of Porta Pia and the incorporation of the city into the Italian state. and of course it could happen again.
The 'prophecies' are so vague that they can be interpreted in any way that one wants.
to take just some of the recent ones ,
Religio depopulata - Benedict XV 1914-22 could this refer to WW1 ?
Fides Intrepida Pius XI 1922-39 could this refer to his Encyclical mit brennender Sorge ?
Pastor Angelicus Pius XII 1939 -58 does this refer to his hieratic aloofness ?
Pastor et Nauta John XXIII 1958 -63 does this refer to his life spent around Mediterranean countries or to the fact that he came as pope from Venice by the sea ?
Flos florum Paul VI does this refer to the fleur de lys in his coat of arms ?
De medietate lunae John Paul I does this refer to his pontificate of one lunar month or to his name Albino Luciani pale white light ?
De labore solis John Paul II a long period in public view ?
De gloria olivae Bendict XVI peace ? but was there peace
Petrus Secundus romanus + the Third Prophecy of Fatima and things don't look too goo
If they leave the monarchy will collapse - or so I have heard.
I should have added earlier 'Add on the Third Secret of Fatima and things don't look too good.
All Christians,of course, have to deal with the prophecies of the end times contained within Sacred Scripture.
Jesus' prophecies were dealt with in 70 AD. John Daniel's shortly after. Well may be a few centuries. Or more...
Just to clarify, it was the people at the Padre Pio prayer group who told you about Pope Joan?
If so, I guess I'm a little surprised, because promotion of the Pope Joan story is something I've always associated with anti-Catholics. But I guess some conspiracy-minded Catholics have found a way to incorporate it into their repertoire?
'Cagey' is the word, and I find that same caginess in many medieval women mystics who knew how to code or conceal the visions that might lead to excommunication or worse. Anne Carson's study in Decreation of the beguine Marguerite Porete, burnt at the stake in 1310, shows why women with 'different' visions or understandings of the Divine walked a dangerous tightrope in any telling or showing of their realities.
Yes, that's true -- but Catholic/Protestant polemics only took place after the Reformation.
Well, quite!
Why not? It's Lockdown the Third here on Brexshit Island, and people are bored...
(I was being ironic, as I'm sure you realise. However, should it be required, I have a newly refurbished Irony-O-Meter for sale at just $999, post & packing extra).
Wouldn't that be Duo Petri?
As soon as you perfect the Irony font, you can by snotty about it. Until then, bugger off.
OK then.
'Bye.
As an Ulster Prod you would've grown up with the knowledge that every Pope that has ever lived is the anti-christ. And that the Roman Church is the Whore or Babylon. Anyone got anything new on this, let me know!!
In the 1970s, Hal Lindsey made it somewhat more palatable to contempary American(ie. Catholic-friendly or at least tolerant) sensibilities by positing that the Whore of Babylon was occultic religious practices like astrology etc.
Which really doesn't make much sense, because why would occultism in the current era be specifically associated with Rome?
Furthermore, while I know people make big bucks off of fortune-telling, it almost certainly isn't the economic mainstay implied by Revelation 18.
As usual with such "prophecies" one just employs a lot of abstract imagery and vague terminology. And then just trust in the ingenuity of the credulous to fill in the blanks for you.