Are the royals on the rocks?

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  • Now I'm curious. :mrgreen:

    Being married to a senior civil servant and ex-army officer are about the only pluses to be weighed against a verrrrry long list of minuses. Forward the new republic!
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate
    Ruth wrote: »
    But how would you know what to ask?!

    It would never have occured to me to ask when to curtsy to the Queen - I'd have assumed that it was strictly for public affairs if you're a member of the family.

    Which is exactly what she assumed. Per the interview: an opportunity to meet the Q came up unusually early in M & H's relationship. IIRC, she was on the phone with H, and he mentioned she'd have to curtsy. Meghan had thought it was like being a celeb, and that the formal stuff was just for outside the family.

    She really seems not to have known much at all about the royals. Nor does her mom. Doria recently asked M, "Did Diana give an interview?"

    Not everyone in America cares about British royals at all. And/or the royals just aren't on their radar at all.

    As far as not researching H: this may just be because I'm not a social media user, but my knee-jerk reaction is "who does that???" I understand doing an informal background check on a stranger you're going to date, or AirBnB host, or an Uber driver. (Or, given a recent incident here in SF, checking up on an Uber *passenger*.) I know that many people check a person's social media life to see what they're like, as do prospective employers.

    If I knew I was to meet a royal, I'd study up on protocol. If I wanted to bring a gift, I'd study up on protocol *and* try to find out a little about the person's interests, so I could try to find a gift they'd like.

    ISTM the only time I'd likely research a royal I was going to meet would be if I knew nothing about them at all. Just in case there'd be small talk.
  • TelfordTelford Shipmate
    I still find it hard to believe that M had heard nothing about the royal family. Did she never read newspapers or watch TV? The whole thing about the royal family is that if one of them so much as farts, endless columns are written about it. And I know that North America is just as fixated as the UK. Just stand in the supermarket checkout queue and count how many magazines on the rack have royal family related headlines.

    Sorry, but I don't buy it.
    It's not "nothing", it's simply not the knowledge that you have, at the level that you have it. Consider, how much do you know about, say, American celebrity families, say the Kardashians? I know that there are some sisters who did a TV show and I think a parent was rich from the hotel business. And someone is married to a rap singer and if I paid attention, is getting divorced recently. In another generation, I do know who Humphrey Bogart is, though nothing about his personal life. Don't really care.

    I did meet my wife's parents and her immediate family before we married. I didn't know the opinions of them nor if they were secretly axe murderers or not who they nicely presented themselves to be. I focused on her, and that floated our boat. Perhaps love comes differently to others.

    The British royal family is, for many, merely another part of celebrity culture. Rich and spoiled and believing than money means you know things and should be listened to because of their status and you can pay people to agree with you. I know people from the UK and some others think that they're "special", but they're not really. I do know that Diana died in a car crash and had a rich boyfriend at the time, that her husband was pretty stodgy and awkward when they married, that they had 2 kids, and the British tabloid press is mostly responsible for her death, that she cut herself and had an eating disorder which her husband and his family are responsible for creating the conditions for. I know next to nothing about the others. Shall I presume The Crown is accurate.

    The facts are that Diana and her boyfriend chose to travel in the rear of a car and did not wear seat belts. The drunken driver was allowed to drive at high speeds and he crashed the c ar

  • TelfordTelford Shipmate
    edited March 11
    Eirenist wrote: »
    A thought about the issue of passport, keys, etc.: Royalty have staff to take care of these things. Nothing sinister about it. She had no idea what she'd got herself into. No wonder she was scared and lonely. Yes, probably all this was explained to her. I doubt if she understood half of the things said to her in a funny accent.

    The only member of the royal family not to have a passport is The Queen. When they go abroad an equerry presents the royal's passport, etc. If it's not an official trip they look after their own passport - no exceptions.

    Meghan would have retained, or her office would have held, her passport. It would have been up to Meghan to ensure her US passport was up-to-date. (She wasn't here long enough to get UK citizenship.)

    The individual members of the family are responsible for their own driving licence - again The Queen is the exception. A US licence is valid in the UK for a year, after that you must take a driving test.

    If Meghan's staff had her passport and licence it could only be because she handed them over. And if she didn't have her passport how did she manage to fly to and from Canada in early 2020?

    It doesn't add up.
    None of her lies add up but Oprah did not challenge anything

  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Imagine being woken up by a military bagpiper. Surely, he asks perjissi

    She gets out of bed to tell him shut the f up, but by then she's well and truly awake.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Prince Philip's mother, Princess Andrew of Greece, smoked Woodbines.

    She spent WW II in a small flat in Athens surviving on the strict rations allowed a single and ageing woman. She did have enough bread to keep her going, but next to nothing else. Despite that, she had helped protect Jewish people and keep them fed also through much of the war.
  • Of course, Oprah didn't bring up the awkward subject of Ninaki Priddy, Meghan's bedt friend from kindergarten right up to her engagement to Prince Harry, including being "maid of honour" (I think that's American for chief bridesmaid) at the Duchess's first wedding in 2011

    There's video and pictures of the pair of them in London, including outside BP, in 1996. According to the friend M was so fascinated by the RF she even bought a copy of Morton's book. So much for her not knowing much about the RF!

    Priddy has since been "ghosted" by her old friend - presumably for having these inconvenient memories but the pictures are out there
  • RuthRuth Shipmate
    Do you think that book would prepare someone from a republic to marry into the royal family?
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    [snip]

    The British royal family is, for many, merely another part of celebrity culture. Rich and spoiled and believing than money means you know things and should be listened to because of their status and you can pay people to agree with you. I know people from the UK and some others think that they're "special", but they're not really. I do know that Diana died in a car crash and had a rich boyfriend at the time, that her husband was pretty stodgy and awkward when they married, that they had 2 kids, and the British tabloid press is mostly responsible for her death, that she cut herself and had an eating disorder which her husband and his family are responsible for creating the conditions for. I know next to nothing about the others. Shall I presume The Crown is accurate.[/quote]


    [snip]
    The facts are that Diana and her boyfriend chose to travel in the rear of a car and did not wear seat belts. The drunken driver was allowed to drive at high speeds and he crashed the c ar

    [/quote]

    NPNP you can safely assume that The Crown is historically accurate with a bit of license in the fine details


    The manner of Diana’s demise (no seatbelts, drunken chauffeur) does not let either the Royals or the British press off the hook

    The former were too stupid to foresee the train wreck of That Marriage and underestimated her severely. The press in its usual fashion were first sycophantic and turned on her when she refused to play the game

  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate
    edited March 12
    Gee D--

    Yes, that would do it! ROTFL. I like bagpipe music, in small doses, but...
    :astonished:

    ETA: Perhaps a royal boot thrown out the window? Just to confirm she heard.
    ;)
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Of course, Oprah didn't bring up the awkward subject of Ninaki Priddy, Meghan's bedt friend from kindergarten right up to her engagement to Prince Harry, including being "maid of honour" (I think that's American for chief bridesmaid) at the Duchess's first wedding in 2011

    There's video and pictures of the pair of them in London, including outside BP, in 1996. According to the friend M was so fascinated by the RF she even bought a copy of Morton's book. So much for her not knowing much about the RF!

    Priddy has since been "ghosted" by her old friend - presumably for having these inconvenient memories but the pictures are out there

    What is your source for the assertion that Ms Priddy has been “ghosted” by Meghan Sussex?

  • Gee D wrote: »
    Prince Philip's mother, Princess Andrew of Greece, smoked Woodbines.

    She spent WW II in a small flat in Athens surviving on the strict rations allowed a single and ageing woman. She did have enough bread to keep her going, but next to nothing else. Despite that, she had helped protect Jewish people and keep them fed also through much of the war.

    Yes! She even hid a Jewish family in her house for over a year. She was questioned by German troops because they knew she was originally British but she played-up her deafness - they didn't realise she spoke and lip-read German.
  • Sojourner wrote: »
    Of course, Oprah didn't bring up the awkward subject of Ninaki Priddy, Meghan's bedt friend from kindergarten right up to her engagement to Prince Harry, including being "maid of honour" (I think that's American for chief bridesmaid) at the Duchess's first wedding in 2011

    There's video and pictures of the pair of them in London, including outside BP, in 1996. According to the friend M was so fascinated by the RF she even bought a copy of Morton's book. So much for her not knowing much about the RF!

    Priddy has since been "ghosted" by her old friend - presumably for having these inconvenient memories but the pictures are out there

    What is your source for the assertion that Ms Priddy has been “ghosted” by Meghan Sussex?

    Apart from the fact Ms Priddy has said so? Well, she wasn't invited to the wedding - quite a big deal since she has known the Duchess since they were 2 years old, she was maid of honour at M's first wedding, etc.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    Golden Key wrote: »
    Gee D--

    Yes, that would do it! ROTFL. I like bagpipe music, in small doses, but...
    :astonished:

    The school I went to was then Presbyterian (now Uniting) and is known for its pipe band. I can't stand them - with one exception. Waiting on the station on a cold and damp morning, listening to the bagpipes coming across from No 1 Oval is tolerable.

    Don't know if it's still the practice, but in both my day and later Dlet's, bandsmen had to go commando, with regular checks by the Pipe Major and his seniors.
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Sojourner wrote: »
    Of course, Oprah didn't bring up the awkward subject of Ninaki Priddy, Meghan's bedt friend from kindergarten right up to her engagement to Prince Harry, including being "maid of honour" (I think that's American for chief bridesmaid) at the Duchess's first wedding in 2011

    There's video and pictures of the pair of them in London, including outside BP, in 1996. According to the friend M was so fascinated by the RF she even bought a copy of Morton's book. So much for her not knowing much about the RF!

    Priddy has since been "ghosted" by her old friend - presumably for having these inconvenient memories but the pictures are out there

    What is your source for the assertion that Ms Priddy has been “ghosted” by Meghan Sussex?

    Apart from the fact Ms Priddy has said so? Well, she wasn't invited to the wedding - quite a big deal since she has known the Duchess since they were 2 years old, she was maid of honour at M's first wedding, etc.

    If that is true then Ms P deserved not to be invited.

    She could have put up & shut up.
  • TheOrganistTheOrganist Shipmate
    edited March 12
    @Sojourner Oh she was 'ghosted' long before Meghan met Harry after the end of M's first marriage.
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Well then why did she expect an invitation to the 2nd wedding?

    I have always understood that being “ ghosted” means no response to text/ email etc

    Perhaps she was dropped and one wonders why

    2 sides to every story, as they say
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate
    Re M's "friend":

    Choice of a maid of honor or matron of honor (if married) is notoriously fraught in all sorts of ways. Feelings get hurt, loyalty is questioned...and that's before the "tradition" of the bride putting her women in awful outfits for the day. (Well, it's notorious for the times it happens, but it doesn't always happen.)

    Friends don't always stay friends, for all sorts of reasons. Sometimes for reasons known only to themselves.

  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    Forthview wrote: »
    On BBC News today there was an interview with the chairman of the John Lewis Business Partnership. I noticed that the said chairman was (a) female, (b) black and (c) a Dame of the British Empire. Was it sexist and racist of me to notice this ?

    Some would say that it was, though I don't really understand why that should be so, even after having it explained to me.

    Which reminds me, oddly, of the time when My Old Mum (who would have been 109 today!) asked me if I would ever consider marrying a *coloured* woman...

    My Mum suggested to me that Asian women were pretty when young, but deteriorated quickly. I was also under no illusions that marrying a Protestant was very unwise. A few years ago, I realised that while she is racist and a religious bigot, her advice and warnings came out of her experiences of bullying and feeling different, as her parents openly confessed different faiths. This was during one of the more hostile sectarian periods in my city, she having been born in 1938.
  • You have to be taught to be a bigot and then you rigidly, lazily and not forgiveably not bother examining your racist attitudes when you're older. Tell the racists they're racists because if you don't, aren't you part of the problem, silently agreeing with it?
  • TelfordTelford Shipmate
    edited March 12
    Sojourner wrote: »
    [snip]

    The British royal family is, for many, merely another part of celebrity culture. Rich and spoiled and believing than money means you know things and should be listened to because of their status and you can pay people to agree with you. I know people from the UK and some others think that they're "special", but they're not really. I do know that Diana died in a car crash and had a rich boyfriend at the time, that her husband was pretty stodgy and awkward when they married, that they had 2 kids, and the British tabloid press is mostly responsible for her death, that she cut herself and had an eating disorder which her husband and his family are responsible for creating the conditions for. I know next to nothing about the others. Shall I presume The Crown is accurate.


    [snip]
    The facts are that Diana and her boyfriend chose to travel in the rear of a car and did not wear seat belts. The drunken driver was allowed to drive at high speeds and he crashed the c ar

    The manner of Diana’s demise (no seatbelts, drunken chauffeur) does not let either the Royals or the British press off the hook
    Problems with the media were not on the death certificate

  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    They aren’t as a matter of course. Nor are arsehole in-laws
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    You have to be taught to be a bigot and then you rigidly, lazily and not forgiveably not bother examining your racist attitudes when you're older. Tell the racists they're racists because if you don't, aren't you part of the problem, silently agreeing with it?

    Not necessarily so. Calling out racism, bigotry and other nastinesses can be such a waste of time and breath, even here



  • TelfordTelford Shipmate
    Sojourner wrote: »
    They aren’t as a matter of course. Nor are arsehole in-laws

    Please explain why you mean by this

  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    You have to be taught to be a bigot and then you rigidly, lazily and not forgiveably not bother examining your racist attitudes when you're older. Tell the racists they're racists because if you don't, aren't you part of the problem, silently agreeing with it?

    Have you made an unwarranted assumption there NP?
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Telford wrote: »
    Sojourner wrote: »
    They aren’t as a matter of course. Nor are arsehole in-laws

    Please explain why you mean by this

    Have you seen either on a death certificate? Of course not

    But she was hounded no doubt about it

    She made some poor choices but none so poor as being steered into that marriage

    Any other wellborn chinless wonder would have been better

  • TelfordTelford Shipmate
    edited March 12
    Sojourner wrote: »
    Telford wrote: »
    Sojourner wrote: »
    They aren’t as a matter of course. Nor are arsehole in-laws

    Please explain why you mean by this

    Have you seen either on a death certificate? Of course not

    But she was hounded no doubt about it

    She made some poor choices but none so poor as being steered into that marriage

    Any other wellborn chinless wonder would have been better
    I can't argue with most of that but the fact remains that she allowed herself to be driven at very high speeds by a drunken driver just to prevent photographers from taking yet more pictures.

    Like someone else in the news recently she was happy to use the media when it suited her

  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Would you not?
  • TelfordTelford Shipmate
    Sojourner wrote: »
    Would you not?

    I would have just ignored them

  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    When young & stupid (not to mention newsworthy)?

    I wonder
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate
    Telford--

    If you had a street gang out to destroy you for their own pleasure and profit,

    --who stalked you 24/7/365 (i.e., all the time),

    --who photographed you as they please and published the photos to the world,

    --who published twisted or fake stories about you,

    --who were literally making you ill,

    and all of that happened non-stop for YEARS, while

    --you were dealing with your husband's relationship with his long-time love ("there were always three of us in this marriage"),

    --you were dealing with the...difficult situation with the in-laws,

    --you were giving birth two and raising two kids, one likely a future king,

    --you were impossibly entangled with the somewhat... cultish... fascination people have with all of them and with you...

    and that gang was still after you...

    How would you handle it? And how well?

  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    And had there not been that collision, you can imagine stories about a high speed chase by the press (not by those employed by that particular publisher of course).
    Sojourner wrote: »
    When young & stupid (not to mention newsworthy)?

    I wonder

    She was young and stupid and despite becoming older, remained stupid.

  • @Golden Key you asked earlier who checked their future partners, the answer is sensible women going on blind dates. Too many have ended up dead from not checking things out.

    Also you've listed what happened to Diana above, and that would have been worth knowing, that this was the dysfunctional family someone was not only marrying into, but was also choosing to join as their permanent career.

    Most sensible people research the new company they are joining to check its reputation.
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Gee D wrote: »
    And had there not been that collision, you can imagine stories about a high speed chase by the press (not by those employed by that particular publisher of course).
    Sojourner wrote: »
    When young & stupid (not to mention newsworthy)?

    I wonder

    She was young and stupid and despite becoming older, remained stupid.

    Can’t disagree; not very bright, completely uneducated and easily manipulated. Mind you, dead at 36 which is pretty young from the perspective of pushing 70

  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    @Golden Key you asked earlier who checked their future partners, the answer is sensible women going on blind dates. Too many have ended up dead from not checking things out.

    Also you've listed what happened to Diana above, and that would have been worth knowing, that this was the dysfunctional family someone was not only marrying into, but was also choosing to join as their permanent career.

    Most sensible people research the new company they are joining to check its reputation.

    When old enough & smart enough. Can’t say I did as a new graduate: in them days you went where you were sent & made the best of it.

    Marriage as a career (🙀) is quite another ballgame

  • But Meghan at 37, married and divorced, should have learned and acted on at least some of the lessons. Diana at 19 had some excuse for not.
  • Low intelligence is neither a choice nor a moral failing.
  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    How does one check out a prospective blind date?
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate
    Gee D--

    Despite becoming older, she was **still trapped**. She tried to gradually work her way out--and look what happened.

    Oh, if only someone in a similar situation could actually get away, leave behind far more than they wanted to, make it to another country, still have the paparazzi street gang after them, have much of their support pulled, make it to another country, and successfully start a new chapter for their well-being and especially that of their baby.
    :star: :star: :star: :star: :star:

    People would applaud their bravery and be happy for them, yes?
    :anguished:

    :not holding my breath for people to do the right thing:
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    But Meghan at 37, married and divorced, should have learned and acted on at least some of the lessons. Diana at 19 had some excuse for not.

    Hang on, Harry’s missus is not divorced or dead

  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    Low intelligence is neither a choice nor a moral failing.

    Quite so. Diana might have done better if she’d been better schooled. Seems as though this was not thought to be useful or important in the social milieu where ( and when) she was raised

  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate
    {Cross-Pond.}
    KarlLB wrote: »
    How does one check out a prospective blind date?

    This.

    I did mention researching if you're going to date a stranger. If going on a blind date, you don't have that chance. So you only use a referrer/intermediary you really trust, get them to come along with you (maybe a double date), meet in a very public place, check them out with your phone under the table, etc.

    Unless "blind date" means something different in the UK?
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate
    Sojourner wrote: »
    But Meghan at 37, married and divorced, should have learned and acted on at least some of the lessons. Diana at 19 had some excuse for not.

    Hang on, Harry’s missus is not divorced or dead

    Divorced from previous marriage, AIUI.

    And not dead--that's what H & M are trying to prevent.
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    That wasn’t my point.

    Point is that comparing Meghan Sussex to her late MIL is neither useful or appropriate

    At least MS had a life ( and a career) pre this marriage

    She was hardly a sacrificial lamb in the way that the wellborn Protestant virgin Diana was, selected for her ability to pop out an heir and a spare
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    I suspect that is what the Firm & their hangers-on hate about her: prima facie evidence that she has a mind of her own ( never mind her being-horrors!-of mixed race
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate
    And an a :gasp; American! Special relationship be damned.
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    You said it
  • KarlLB wrote: »
    How does one check out a prospective blind date?

    You don't, but you make damn sure it's in a public place with all precautions made. And you check the guy out before any second or third date.

    And to be honest, a blind date may not be that blind, it's just an introduction to someone you didn't know.
  • The Queen is a woman who chooses to be woken up by a military bagpiper on a daily basis ...
    Not true. She's woken by her dresser with a cup of tea. The bagpiper plays outside on the terrace while she's eating breakfast.

    That's alright then. I was beginner to wonder whether Her Majesty might be a little eccentric.
  • Golden KeyGolden Key Shipmate
    Does the Q particularly like Scottish things and people? She's said to really like staying at Balmoral, and IIRC that's in Scotland.
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