How is Brexit affecting us?

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  • Fawkes CatFawkes Cat Shipmate
    Eirenist wrote: »
    Johnny Foreigner isn't going to go away, though. But as long as we have the Falklands and two large empty aircraft carriers, as you say, Bishp's Finger, who cares?

    We have TWO aircraft carriers?
    :flushed:

    Who knew? World, here we come!

    The proper number is - of course - three. But procurement is a balance between affordability and the kinds of commands that the seniors had on their way up.

    OK. I'll bite. Why three?

    I can understand two, in that one may be in dock, doing whatever ships do in dock, while the other is out roaming the high seas - and presumably the aim is to have one ship constantly at sea. But surely ships aren't like shiftworkers so that you need a daytime ship, an evening ship and a nighttime ship? I can imagine that a ship may have enough crew so that some of them are relaxing and others are asleep while the rest of the crew are doing sailorly things, but surely they still only need one ship to do it on.
  • Fawkes Cat wrote: »
    OK. I'll bite. Why three?

    Platforms like that require a considerable amount of maintenance after a tour of duty. Once maintenance is complete there's a fixed rota of training to ensure that all crew members understand and can implement current operating procedures. Once ticks have accumulated in the right boxes the ship is ready for another tour. The general practice is for one ship to be undergoing refit, while another is training and the third is touring.

    You can sweat your assets for short periods of time, but you start to notch up fatigue related failures (both in terms of machinery and of crew) which costs over the long haul.
  • Fawkes CatFawkes Cat Shipmate
    Fawkes Cat wrote: »
    OK. I'll bite. Why three?

    Platforms like that require a considerable amount of maintenance after a tour of duty. Once maintenance is complete there's a fixed rota of training to ensure that all crew members understand and can implement current operating procedures. Once ticks have accumulated in the right boxes the ship is ready for another tour. The general practice is for one ship to be undergoing refit, while another is training and the third is touring.

    You can sweat your assets for short periods of time, but you start to notch up fatigue related failures (both in terms of machinery and of crew) which costs over the long haul.

    Thanks. So to cut it short, in normal times (I imagine wartime is different) ships are only usable for about a third of the time.
  • Jane RJane R Shipmate
    And as Doc Tor pointed out, without an escort of frigates and destroyers, an aircraft carrier is just a very big target. Just as well we're not at war with anyone (yet).
  • The row over vaccine efficacy and distribution is doing it's bit to stoke the Brexit cause. Nothing at all to do with the piss-poor roll-out run by various governments of course.
  • Jane RJane R Shipmate
    Well, it's about as logical as anything else to do with Brexit.
  • The row over vaccine efficacy and distribution is doing it's bit to stoke the Brexit cause. Nothing at all to do with the piss-poor roll-out run by various governments of course.

    I might just include our own in this.

    My arm, despite my very best efforts, remains unpricked. And is looking to stay that way for the foreseeable.
  • What no one seems prepared to say is how well the UK is doing - not just highlighting how we and the Swedes (don't forget them) gave AstraZeneca the support and put serious money into production facilities, but also in having decided from the get-go that the AZ vaccine would be provided at cost.

    Moreover, we have raised £1.09 billion (£548 government money, doubled by match-funding) for the COVAX Advance Market Commitment to provide vaccines for 92 poorer countries identified by the WHO. That's more than the EU.

    On top of that, the UK government has committed to giving FOC all unused vaccine wheb our own vaccination programme has been completed.

    We mustn't just swallow the line being peddled that the UK is 'hogging' vaccine - in this instance our government is actually behaving very well.
  • I don't think the UK govt is buy the AZ vaccine at cost. Given that the UK is buying it at £3 per dose and the EU at £1.57 (may vary with exchange rates) this would require them to be selling to the EU at below cost if the £3 the UK is paying is cost price. More likely, the cost is less than £1.50 and they're making a profit from sales to both UK and EU.

    The only commitment I've heard is that AZ will sell the vaccines at cost to lower income nations. While the UK enjoys the wealth accrued from EU membership we're not a lower income nation - though give it a decade for the wealth we have to be lost and things might change (unless we jump back into the EU)
  • sionisaissionisais Shipmate
    Brexit has provoked me to use the ‘F’ word on Facebook in response to the reported disruption of supplies of anti-convulsant drugs. These were being bought direct from the Netherlands, and there was no problem but the PWB have now put their foot down. Worse still, it’s mostly used for children who have forms of epilepsy that mainstream drugs don’t control.
  • We can give sell them blue passports while they wait (printed in Poland).
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    The UK culture secretary has now outlined proposals for the so-called 'Festival of Brexit', to be enjoyed/inflicted on the nation next year. 120 million pounds is to be spent on the project by a grateful nation.





  • PigletPiglet All Saints Host, Circus Host
    I don't think "grateful" is quite the word you were looking for.

    [/snark]
  • Some of the events may well be quite entertaining, or then again, maybe not. Will they be crowd-funded?

    Bung Boris a Bob for the Big Brexit Bash!
    Meanwhile, where's my bloody Unicorn?
  • Jane RJane R Shipmate
    Well, in our household the announcement that the festivities would include a "celebration" of British weather provided some much-needed light relief.
  • [Best BR station announcer voice] "We regret to inform you that the scheduled celebration of British weather has been cancelled because of the wrong kind of snow".
  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    edited March 27
    Jane R wrote: »
    Well, in our household the announcement that the festivities would include a "celebration" of British weather provided some much-needed light relief.

    I would celebrate it. I love our weather. It's never too cold, only too hot for a few days or a week or two at worst most years, and almost never homicidal. I can't think of anywhere that has a better climate. And no, I'm not being sarky. It's one of the things I genuinely love about living here. Everywhere else seems too hot, too cold, or quite often both depending on the time of year.
  • Jane RJane R Shipmate
    I didn't say I disliked it - I just think the idea of preening ourselves on how marvellous it is is silly. It's not like we have any control over it.
  • AnselminaAnselmina Shipmate
    Are the terms 'celebrating' and 'preening' interchangeable? I think it's possible to celebrate something without being full of self-pride over it.
  • A good wake is a celebration of a good and long life, while at the same time grieving the loss of that person in life.
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    and also for the celebration of a life which might have been relatively short and ( in the view of some) not particularly well-lived
  • It's almost 90 days since the last ties with the EU were cut. That means those Brits who've been living in the EU since the end of the transition period now need to return to the UK for at least 180d, because they're only allowed 90d residence in the EU - unless, of course, they've taken up citizenship of the nation they're living in. Tough on those who voted for the UK to remain in the EU. But the worlds smallest violin (thanks Brian Moore for that image) is out for those who voted for the UK to leave the EU and are now unhappy about returning to the UK.
  • Fawkes CatFawkes Cat Shipmate
    It's almost 90 days since the last ties with the EU were cut. That means those Brits who've been living in the EU since the end of the transition period now need to return to the UK for at least 180d, because they're only allowed 90d residence in the EU - unless, of course, they've taken up citizenship of the nation they're living in. Tough on those who voted for the UK to remain in the EU. But the worlds smallest violin (thanks Brian Moore for that image) is out for those who voted for the UK to leave the EU and are now unhappy about returning to the UK.

    I haven't been following this issue, but isn't there a possibility of applying for whatever the EU equivalent is of 'indefinite leave to remain'?
  • There was. They didn't do it because British Exceptionalism.
  • HeavenlyannieHeavenlyannie Shipmate
    edited March 29
    I gather from the BBC article that some of them previously did not register for tax reasons, ie they weren't paying any.
  • Doubtless if they do return to the shores they were so happy to leave, they will blame the filthy foreign EU. As will the press. I'm afraid if they want sympathy from me, they can kiss my arse.
  • FirenzeFirenze Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    edited March 29
    There was a piece in The Guardian on how, as demand soars, there are severe delays to, and shortages of, plants, garden furnishings and foreign workers (to do all the laborious harvesting and packaging).

    I'm wondering if it will dawn on the Home Counties 'It won't affect us' Brexiteers that they may not have their research stymied, or their careers in music/arts wrecked but that no bedding plants or patio furniture is all part of the same thing?

    Meanwhile the hanging plant pot I ordered a month ago may be dispatched in late June (by which time I shall have improvised something with a cheap basket and some string).
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    In other news, the blockage of the Suez Canal may perhaps have reminded some that cutting trade ties with near neighbours in favour of getting our supplies from distant lands afar may not be without its hazards.
  • Obviously it means we need to go over there and sort things out, make sure only the right sort of ships get to use the canal. A wee military adventure, it worked so well last time. Good use for the aircraft carriers we have to show that Britannia rules the waves.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited March 29
    One of our nice shiny nuclear submarines would have shifted the blockage in no time at all (assuming that we actually have any nuclear subs, with suitable missiles aboard...).

    Any fall-out wouldn't matter, as Egypt is already a desert, anyway, with only Brown People Not Like Us living there.

    (BTW, I see that the Offending Vessel is now on the move once more.)
  • Obviously it means we need to go over there and sort things out, make sure only the right sort of ships get to use the canal. A wee military adventure, it worked so well last time. Good use for the aircraft carriers we have to show that Britannia rules the waves.

    I could see our current government somehow contriving to get HMS Queen Elizabeth wedged in much the same manner as the Ever Given.
  • Firenze wrote: »
    I'm wondering if it will dawn on the Home Counties 'It won't affect us' Brexiteers that they may not have their research stymied, or their careers in music/arts wrecked but that no bedding plants or patio furniture is all part of the same thing?

    The majority of Home Counties Brexiters were and are retired or very close to it.
  • la vie en rougela vie en rouge Circus Host, 8th Day Host
    I'm just still bummed that I can't get marmalade anymore. (For now I have a stockpile of tea.)
  • No Marmalade = A Bad Thing.

    I wonder if there's a possible opening here for an English manufacturer to move at least part of the business to France (or another EU state) in order to make proper marmalade and/or jam?

    Tiptree-sur-Mer, perhaps?

    I'm not being entirely frivolous, because Holes like this, although small in themselves, perhaps, may lend themselves to be filled by peeps with a bit of imagination...
  • la vie en rougela vie en rouge Circus Host, 8th Day Host
    Jam is not a problem. Indeed I think the French make better jam than the English do. Orange marmalade as the English like it, however, doesn't really exist on this side of the Channel. They have orange jam, but it's not the same.
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    Marmalade needs to be made with Seville oranges - it's even better witha few lemons. Bitter jam is an alien Anglo-Saxon concept to the French, like Marmite.
  • Well, there's still an opening for someone, perhaps, to make Proper Marmalade in France or elsewhere...

    Orange Jam is, indeed, not at all the same thing.
    Meanwhile, there are potential problems for UK citizens in France who rely on their cars:
    https://theguardian.com/world/2021/mar/30/britons-in-france-could-lose-driving-licences-due-to-post-brexit-impasse

    The words *Post-Brexit Impasse* are becoming all too frequent in news reports...
  • We have some excellent marmalade makers in our church. In the first week after Brexit took effect one of the said marmaladers had all their Seville oranges confiscated on arrival from the UK.
  • We have some excellent marmalade makers in our church. In the first week after Brexit took effect one of the said marmaladers had all their Seville oranges confiscated on arrival from the UK.

    :open_mouth:

    Is it possible to obtain the oranges direct from Spain (I assume Seville oranges come from that country)?
  • I think the vast majority of Seville oranges are exported to the UK for marmalade, probably like many things a relatively small number of importers who then sell on to end users - even when those are elsewhere in Europe. There probably isn't a big enough market for these oranges for anyone else to buy them up for local use. There may be options for individual church marmalade makers to buy direct from the producers, but that needs a rethink of how people shop.
  • la vie en rougela vie en rouge Circus Host, 8th Day Host
    I now have acceptable marmalade, having been on a foraging expedition to Marks and Sparks this morning. No doubt about it, though - M&S isn't what it was. A lot of products are missing.
  • Glad to hear the Expotition was successful, but (just out of interest) what other products are missing?

  • Ethne AlbaEthne Alba Shipmate
    @Bishops Finger , Are you considering moving into import/ export?
  • I think the phrase you're looking for is 'smuggling'.
  • Ethne AlbaEthne Alba Shipmate
    (Trying so hard not to inhale my cup of tea!)
  • FirenzeFirenze Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    Turn your face to the wall my dear, while the Marmalade men go by.
  • EirenistEirenist Shipmate
    Be careful. Wasn't import/expot Mr Norris's line of business (among other things)?
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited March 31
    Ethne Alba wrote: »
    @Bishops Finger , Are you considering moving into import/ export?

    Well, as others have suggested, I might be thinking of Smuggling - an ancient, albeit perhaps not entirely honourable, occupation in these parts.

    I am, of course, emphatically NOT intending to break the Law...that would be Sinful...
    :wink:
  • not even in a specific and limited way?
  • "Bootleggers Finger"...
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