Let's put lilbuddha in charge

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  • RossweisseRossweisse Shipmate, Hell Host
    ...I have gone to the trouble of quoting all that, because your paraphrases tend to tilt the argument. Which is, I think, partly what Euty’s issue is with you. You read in stuff that is not there, and then become aggressive about it.
    This. (Thank you.)


  • RooK wrote: »
    lilbuddha wrote: »
    RooK wrote: »
    I did not have the required fucks to give to endure the entire linked thread, but what I did review clearly showed yellibuddha reading assertions into Eutytrash's posts which were clearly not there.

    The most obvious being that the suggestion lilbuddha should not comment for lack of religious credentials, in place of what was actually stated. Which was a weary comment from Euty about not trusting the process due to lilbuddha not offering an alternate philosophy to defend reciprocally, and perhaps only engaging enough to find points to gnaw.
    Still not seeing why this is at all relevant. Were I all attack, then I could understand the complaint. However, on this Ship I have defended Christianity, encouraged doubters to not lose their faith, etc. Whilst I do like to explore concepts robustly (AKA argue) I do not do so from an anti-Christian POV. All that should matter in a discussion is the validity of the statements being made.

    I'm not meaning to imply that I agree with Euty's assertion that you have no philosophical stance (hence my third paragraph previously), but he most definitely did not come anywhere near saying that you should not participate.
    Motherfuck. You've no clue at how annoying it is to concede any part of this point.
    Though it is still on the same road, IMO, it didn't go all the way to town. In other words, still bloody irrelevant.
  • Gee DGee D Shipmate
    lilbuddha, a few posts ago, you said "Hell, read my synopsis. It is fairly accurate to what went down and in what order" - which I take as an admission that you knew when you posted what you attributed to others was inaccurate. Your admission is to being only fairly accurate there but can you admit now, even to yourself that it was much more inaccurate?
  • EutychusEutychus Admin
    edited February 2019
    Let me just make it clear that for my part, I don't in the slightest object to debating what @RooK calls the null hypothesis.

    (I might argue that there could be better places to do so than that thread, which to my mind is on a pretty specialist topic focusing on the Bible, which by her own admission @lilbuddha has not actually read in its entirety).

    But what I'm objecting to here is being quoted, repeatedly, as saying the Bible is without error when I never said that: in the context of that thread, that is like claiming I was pro-choice rather than pro-life. That's no basis for debate; that's spoiling for a fight.
    lilbuddha wrote: »
    You've no clue at how annoying it is to concede any part of this point.

    A revealing admission. You seem to find it nigh impossible to concede anything. It's like "Never. Concede. Anything" is debate 101 for you. This doesn't help. It doesn't make you look brave or determined. It makes you look stubborn and closed-minded.

    I've conceded several things on this thread alone, and acknowledged that you've provided a useful concept to move my own thinking forward (no guarantee it will go where you want it to, admittedly). Would it really be so hard to concede you were wrong to say I believed the Bible was without error when I never said any such thing? What would it cost you do to that?

    [x-post but here, I'm with @Gee D all the way]
  • Okay, here we are again.

    I don't particularly give a shit what you've been saying about me. It's been mildly amusing to watch you stand in the spotlight, all by your lonesome, chucking cowpies at everybody while Ruth attempts to instill some sense into your head.

    But what the FUCK were you thinking when you said this to a terminally ill cancer patient?
    lilbuddha wrote: »
    This post aside, I will likely continue to ignore you. Addressing some subjects is more important than addressing posts of febrile delusion.

    Damn, damn, DAMN, that's cold.

    And you want to be respected?
  • RossweisseRossweisse Shipmate, Hell Host
    Lilbuddha doesn't care if she is respected, because she is both omniscient (so that she can tell you both what you're thinking and feeling and how you should think and feel), and Always Right. She treats Shipmates, Hosts & Admins, and the rules with contempt. As far as I can tell, she only comes to the Ship in order to press her claims of superiority and to harangue those of us she considers her inferiors.

    I don't particularly care if she insults me; it's what she does. The "febrile delusion" accusation seemed cruel and over the top, because I do have terminal cancer. My greatest fear is that when I have to go into hospice, when I'm dying, the pain will be so great that I will have to take mind-muddying meds. That's not a secret. But no blow is too low for lilbuddha.

  • You know, lilbuddha, I thought I'd just let you know I'm having a biopsy tomorrow. You know, to make your insulting me a bit easier? Since you stoop to those depths.
  • I will participate in this only as far as this post, so vent however you like.

    Treating Rossweisse with the same level of dignity that I would treat anyone else is cold?
    You have a strange view of life.
    For anyone rational who is reading this, the post that triggered LC was not the one she quoted, but this one to Rossweisse in Purg.
    lilbuddha wrote: »
    Rossweisse wrote: »
    And it takes a special kind of person to accuse someone with terminal cancer of "febrile delusion," as you did in the Styx. My physical problems are getting worse as it advances, of course, but I don't have a fever, and my mind is still functioning just fine, thank you.
    I am treating you just as I would treat anyone else. I've treated terminally ill friends and family as I normally treat them. It does people a disservice to treat them as anything less than fully functionality persons, excepting obvious catering to physical issues, of course.

    If one steps into the mosh pit, one will get jostled. If one swings metaphorical fists in Purg, one should expect a rejoinder. Purgatory is not all-saints. She knows the rules of Purg as well as I do.

    You will not likely believe this, not will she, but I sincerely wish she did not have cancer, especially not terminal. No one deserves that.
    I was not poking fun at the cancer, it was a nicer way describe the fucked up thought process she was using.

    Anyway, as I said, this is my only post addressing this.

    Have fun abusing me if it makes you feel better.
  • Abusing you???? Child, you don't know the meaning of the term. But you will, if you stop to meditate on what you've just done.
  • RossweisseRossweisse Shipmate, Hell Host
    lilbuddha wrote: »
    Treating Rossweisse with the same level of dignity that I would treat anyone else is cold? ...
    Which is to say, no dignity at all. Mocking my cancer, and ascribing to me symptoms from which I do not suffer, when you know what's happening to me, is pretty cruel.
    ...If one steps into the mosh pit, one will get jostled. If one swings metaphorical fists in Purg, one should expect a rejoinder. Purgatory is not all-saints. She knows the rules of Purg as well as I do. ...
    Purgatory is not supposed to be a mosh pit. Purgatory is not Hell, either. The intro to that forum says, "Pull up a chair, get your brain in gear, and prepare for some serious time in Purgatory. This is our proper debate space for theology, ethics, politics, science, tech and culture." You weren't debating; you were insulting and treating others as though they were idiots for having the temerity to disagree with you - as you frequently do.

    We both overstepped the rules of Purg and the Styx on this one. The difference is that I apologized and withdrew, while you simply doubled down - as usual. You can't even take a legitimate criticism from a Host.
    ...I was not poking fun at the cancer, it was a nicer way describe the fucked up thought process she was using. ...
    Have fun abusing me if it makes you feel better.
    Yes, you were poking fun at the cancer, there was nothing "fucked up" about my thought processes, and no one is abusing you.

    If you want to run away instead of actually addressing criticisms, no one will be surprised. It's too bad, though, because you're intelligent and articulate, and we could probably have a good discussion if you could ever consider another viewpoint besides your own.


  • <Hugs> to Ross!
  • "Mosh pit"? WTF? lB thinks it's her own personal boxing ring, apparently. She's not capable of rational, dispassionate discussion, from anything I've seen. I'm adding her to my "scroll past" list. (She's only #3)
  • RossweisseRossweisse Shipmate, Hell Host
    Thank you, @Robert Armin!

    Yes, @mousethief. Really? A mosh pit?!? Telling, isn't it?

    I need to start a "scroll past" list. Life really is too short to waste on trolls (and that is what she is) like lB.

  • lilbuddha wrote: »
    I will participate in this only as far as this post, so vent however you like.

    Treating Rossweisse with the same level of dignity that I would treat anyone else is cold?
    You have a strange view of life.
    .

    You mean indignity, surely. That post of yours with "febrile delusion" is by far the most cruel I've read on the Ship. And still no proper apology.
  • Please everyone, remember thou art human, and internet barbs can hurt.

    (sorry, I veer from saint to devil. I'm about to go and gloat on the cricket thread).
  • Being new to the Ship, the second thing I learned was to avoid posting on any thread where lilbuddha is active. Since she’s not active here, I’m still keeping to that rule.
  • mousethiefmousethief Shipmate
    edited September 2019
    Dear God in heaven, she's getting as professorly as James Boswell II. She's teaching us arithmetic, waiting until we're ready for her to teach us algebra, following which she'll treat us to a course in calculus. Stuck up fool.
    lilbuddha wrote: »
    My point, is that identity both claimed and attributed, is more complex than you seem to be describing on this thread - and oppression is not simply graduated by depth of skin tone. Intersectionality matters, context matters both social and national.
    Not more complex than I think it is. For much of the thread, we've had very loud people who do not appear to grasp, or at least accept, the basic principle. Just like maths, adding complexity too soon causes confusion.
    SO one starts with the basics. Arithmetic before calculus, Newton before Einstein. We have not left the arithmetic stage on this thread yet.

  • Great is lilbuddha, All Knowing, All Wise.
  • {{{{{{{Rossweisse}}}}}}}
  • It's just so lovely to be told we're not equals. I knew it, of course, but having it confirmed is just the cat's pajamas. It gives me that warm tingly feeling.
  • "It hurts my mind just to think down to your level." ---Marvin the Paranoid Android (from The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, by Douglas Adams)
  • It's just so lovely to be told we're not equals. I knew it, of course, but having it confirmed is just the cat's pajamas. It gives me that warm tingly feeling.

    This is all worth everything lilbuddha does that’s annoying because LC just un-ironically referred to something as the “cat’s pajamas” as a way of noting approval. I’ve a hard time not giggling like a child whenever I come across the rare bird that chirps “cat’s pajamas.”

  • hee hee hee. What a lovely frame of mind I'm in for writing devotions! Well, it IS the last chapter of Malachi. Not a particularly pacific chapter...
  • lilbuddha--

    You're digging yourself in deeper, and casting rocks and debris all around.

    .JUST. .STOP.

    Take a breath.

    You keep saying people are misinterpreting much of what you say. You seem to be missing that a variety of Shipmates, who usually don't necessarily agree on much, are all coming to similar understandings of your posts.

    That means something. I don't know whether it's a communication problem, or what. Another option would be that you're just yanking people's chains.

    I hope you're not. If you are, quit it.

    If you're not, then please take on board that many Shipmates have actually been trying to *talk* with you.

    But the more you come across as saying "you're all bad and wrong, and you just don't want to deal with The Truth (tm), and weary me will explain it again, but you just won't get it", the more Shipmates will either "tear you a new one", or ignore you--and not just on this thread.

    If you feel you're trying to have an honest discussion, it's not working. IMHO, take a breath, maybe take a break, come back, listen, and try something new.
  • There was an inspirational meme in my FB feed a few days ago.

    "A critical part of self care is refusing to argue with those who are committed to misunderstanding or misinterpreting you."

    I think this is a motto for the internet age.

    AFF
  • Part of the problem here, I believe, is that lilbuddha's basic stance toward shipmates has for years pretty consistently been, "I am not one of you. I am here among you, I post on threads, but I stand apart from you. I am alone."

    While it is lilbuddha's right to remain (as it were) "veiled," revealing as little as possible about herself, this choice places those who interact with her in a difficult position. It's hard, perhaps impossible, to gauge where her sensitivities lie, or even if she has any. At some level, those of us who attempt engaging with her find ourselves involved in a kind of metaphorical wire-drawing competition: no matter what draw-hole we select, it is never quite the correct gauge, because it neglects potential Aspect A, wounds hypothetical Victim B, overlooks possible Issue C, and so on. We can almost never be right. And because we know so little of her, we can never be quite sure where's she's coming from (she is not especially forthcoming about her moral constructs, either, beyond the fact that the moral precepts any of us may offer are woefully inadequate, according to her).

    Others of us, meanwhile, remain vulnerable to attacks based on what we do reveal about ourselves. lilbuddha can insist that shipmate A subscribes to Biblical inerrancy based on her reading of his posts, despite his claims to the contrary. She can dismiss a dying shipmate's post with the same brusque disregard she claims to favor everyone with. She seems to have, relationally speaking, to have established herself alone atop a mental hilltop fortress, all-but-invulnerable to attack herself, but ever-alert and ready with arrows and burning pitch against incoming threats.

    While there may be good and sound reasons for lilbuddha's self-concealment -- perhaps it's self-protective -- it strikes me that at some level it's also deeply unfair -- possibly not least to lilbuddha herself.

    For what it's worth, though, if she continues to post raw (and probably unfalsifiable and IMO outrageously racist) assertions about Obama's light skin color being responsible for his getting elected, picking apart Ruth's extremely generous treatment of her in Styx, and bashing terminally-ill shipmates, I'm scrolling past her posts for the duration.

  • RossweisseRossweisse Shipmate, Hell Host
    Lilbuddha is not here to have discussions. She is here to lecture and to pontificate, and to inform us that we are not her equals.

    She is a bully. Like most bullies, she's also a coward, which is why she refuses to engage with those who make valid points (or request little things like support for her more outrageous assertions), for fear that - like the rest of us, her inferiors - she might have to admit that she's wrong about something. She uses the Ship as her sandbox. She certainly doesn't care anything about the stated purpose of Purgatory.

  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    edited September 2019
    There was an inspirational meme in my FB feed a few days ago.

    "A critical part of self care is refusing to argue with those who are committed to misunderstanding or misinterpreting you."

    I think this is a motto for the internet age.

    AFF

    I like it. At least limit your argument to that page, and the occasional snipe thereafter.

    I don't experience LB as a bully. I experience her as earnest and stubborn. My only advice to her is don't repeat your argument more than once or twice. Let what you said stand. My advice to others is to not assume bad intent.
  • LB is an anti-bully. It's what she rages against, more often than not.
  • I'm afraid that has not been my experience of her.
  • Is she a bully, or abrasive? When she is at the bottom of a game of stacks on the mill, who is bullying who?
  • Simon Toad wrote: »
    LB is an anti-bully. It's what she rages against, more often than not.

    We always hate most in others what we fear most in ourselves.
  • I'm sorry LC. I feel I overstepped. I forgot I knew nothing much about you and your experience. I don't want to tell you or anybody how to react.
  • Well, most of my recent experience with lilbuddha as well as an outline of my Cherokee background and forced loss of culture is on that thread, if you'd have a wish to see it. Truthfully, she's not the first nor the worst of those in my life who have told me I have no right to claim I understand anything, and have basically told me to stick to my own knitting. White knitting, of course, because skin hue is all that matters, and 30 years of interracial marriage and childbearing mean nothing. In Missouri. As an integral key part and servant of the local refugee community for all those years.
    You have done me no harm. But lilbuddha should think twice, thrice, and time again before she tries to toss me out on my ear as a mere white woman who knows jackshit. I've laid down my own sweat and blood on this stuff. I've earned the right to be a part of the conversation.
  • RossweisseRossweisse Shipmate, Hell Host
    Simon Toad wrote: »
    LB is an anti-bully. It's what she rages against, more often than not.
    It is one of many things against which she rages. That doesn't mean that she's incapable of being a bully herself, and in that thread she is guilty.

    Referring to Purgatory as a "mosh pit" also suggests a willingness to do whatever it takes to win an argument - and "winning," in such a case, does not necessarily meaning having the best facts and logic at one's fingertips.


  • Simon Toad wrote: »
    I forgot I knew nothing much about you and your experience.

    This is a very good reminder to us all. This is the position we are all in all the time with everybody we meet. We see only the surface of a very deep lake.
    I don't want to tell you or anybody how to react.

    If only lB had that attitude.

  • RossweisseRossweisse Shipmate, Hell Host
    mousethief wrote: »
    Simon Toad wrote: »
    ...I don't want to tell you or anybody how to react.

    If only lB had that attitude.
    That's one of the problems with imagining that one is omniscient and has all the answers.


  • Do Buddhists believe in apologizing? mending their ways? Or perhaps @lilbuddha is not actually Buddhist.
  • RossweisseRossweisse Shipmate, Hell Host
    @NOprophet_NØprofit She does seem to have a decidedly idiosyncratic understanding of the concept of Zen.
  • Buddhism takes many forms, and Buddhists are susceptible to all the same things that everyone else is. Just like Christians are.
  • RossweisseRossweisse Shipmate, Hell Host
    Oh, don't we know it!
  • Do Buddhists believe in apologizing? mending their ways? Or perhaps @lilbuddha is not actually Buddhist.

    lilbuddha does Buddhists and Buddhism no favours, whether she is a Buddhist or not..
  • Will wonders never cease? From the "White Supremacy Thread" thread in Styx:
    lilbuddha wrote: »
    And I'm learning that a fight isn't catharsis for anger, so much as reinforcement of it.

    Brava! It's long overdue.
  • finelinefineline Kerygmania Host
    Lilbuddha, you have been arguing strongly that intent isn’t relevant in racism - that a person can still be racist and harmful without being aware. So if a white person calls a black person a monkey, and then argues that they treat everyone the same and would also call a white person a monkey, and so it’s not the slightest bit racist, I imagine you (and plenty of others) would take issue with this. Maybe the person is aware of the racist implications, maybe they’re not, but they need to become aware, and to apologise.

    Can you not see that the same applies to other vulnerable groups of people? That you need to be conscious and sensitive with the language you use?
  • Picking up on @fineline , your tone is frequently aggressive, via word choice stridency. Maybe try to a post without the word "fuck" or other similar, and consider how to make your view understood without. It's beyond the purpose of Hell, but frankly am wondering if we're seeing expression of something bothering you beyond what we discuss on the Ship given your pattern.
  • finelinefineline Kerygmania Host
    Just realised that what I was referring to in this thread was posted a month ago. I've got a bit behind in these threads - I saw the thread had been updated, and thought all that had just been posted. I don't want to bring up old wounds. Though if it's something you hadn't been aware of, Lilbuddha, it's worth thinking about. I've mentioned before to you about how you can sometimes be quite ableist without realising. Since you are so very aware of how people can be racist and transphobic without realising, it's important to also be aware of your own blind spots when it comes to other kinds of '-isms', and the different ways they can manifest. No good being all woke about one type of -ism while oblivious to another - not least because no one will take you seriously when you try to enlighten them.
  • Narrator: they did not need enlightening.
  • finelinefineline Kerygmania Host
    Heh, yes, that too.
  • fineline wrote: »
    Lilbuddha, you have been arguing strongly that intent isn’t relevant in racism - that a person can still be racist and harmful without being aware. So if a white person calls a black person a monkey, and then argues that they treat everyone the same and would also call a white person a monkey, and so it’s not the slightest bit racist, I imagine you (and plenty of others) would take issue with this. Maybe the person is aware of the racist implications, maybe they’re not, but they need to become aware, and to apologise.

    Didn't this happen recently, when Harry and Meghan's baby was born? Some comedian published a photo of a couple with a chimp in a suit. He claimed he was mocking posh people, and that he would have done the same for a white couple. On the whole he wasn't believed.
  • asherasher Shipmate
    Lilbudda sometimes feels a bit Titania McGrath
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