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Heaven: 2021 December Book Discussion A Child's Christmas in Wales & Christmas Poetry

SarasaSarasa All Saints Host
edited August 2022 in Limbo
This month's book is A Child's Christmas in Wales by Dylan Thomas. I've not read it, so it will be something new for me too. I'll post some questions up on the 20th, or maybe a bit before.
In the meantime I thought we could discuss some of our favourite Christmas poems. I guess we'd better not post whole poems due to copyright issues though. One of my favourite's is UA Fanthorpe's BC:AD This was the moment when Before/Turned into After. Which ones do you like?

Comments

  • MiliMili Shipmate
    I will join in. I had an inkling this book might have been adapted into a film which I watched as a child and sure enough it was adapted in 1987. I think they showed it on T.V. every December for a few years after that in Australia, and I found it quite magical, as we don't have snowy winters here. I remember the main character looking in windows. I found it online and have rewatched and have been saving reading the whole poem until close to Christmas.

    I don't know that many Christmas poems, but despite never liking Santa Claus/Father Christmas, I liked the imagery in 'Twas the Night Before Christmas' by Clement Clarke Moore. I have a picture book of the poem, though I can't find who the illustrator of my copy was online. I think I still own it, but it is packed away in storage at the moment. It was cute, but fairly cartoonish and it looks like there are much more beautifully illustrated versions out there.
  • They don't often have snowy winters in south-west Wales either! My wife gave me a copy last Christmas, I enjoyed it but it's a bit self-consciously over-written for my taste. Reminded me a bit of Laurie Lee's Christmas in "Cider with Rosie".
  • MooMoo Kerygmania Host
    They don't often have snowy winters in south-west Wales either! My wife gave me a copy last Christmas, I enjoyed it but it's a bit self-consciously over-written for my taste. Reminded me a bit of Laurie Lee's Christmas in "Cider with Rosie".

    I think the point is that this is a child's recollections, which are not necessarily factual.

  • I like Mary and Gabriel by Rupert Brooke
  • NenyaNenya All Saints Host, Ecclesiantics & MW Host
    Reminded me a bit of Laurie Lee's Christmas in "Cider with Rosie".
    Thank you for that. I'm doing a lot of comfort rereading at the moment and was wondering where to go next. *Finds copy of "Cider With Rosie" and puts it on bedside cabinet for attention later*

    Regarding Christmas poetry, I love the U A Fanthorpe that's been mentioned and "What the Donkey Saw".

    I must make sure I've got my usual Christmas rereading to hand - last year I somehow missed doing it completely. Some of it is very short - Alison Uttley's "Little Grey Rabbit's Christmas", for example. One of the others is quite a tome - Rosamunde Pilcher's "Winter Solstice" - but it's very light reading and I skim along until I get to my favourite bits. There's something hugely comforting about everyone cosying up in the big house in Scotland for Christmas.
  • Nenya wrote: »
    Regarding Christmas poetry, I love the U A Fanthorpe that's been mentioned and "What the Donkey Saw".
    Yes. I've used the Fanthorpe one in Christmas services. Do you know Benjamin Zephaniah's "Talking Turkeys

  • NenyaNenya All Saints Host, Ecclesiantics & MW Host
    Do you know Benjamin Zephaniah's "Talking Turkeys

    I didn't - but have now googled. :smile:
  • A Child's Christmas in Wales has been read in this and the in-laws' house at Christmas for as long as anyone can remember, which must be hundreds of years by now, since the dinosaurs roamed. We go round taking turns to read a couple of pages. But best of all is listening to Thomas reading it himself - we have the vinyl LP, but there must be lots of other versions now. It is sublime - I shall never tire of it.
  • SarasaSarasa All Saints Host
    Well it's the 20th so a few questions on A Child's Christmas in Wales.. Just a few questions this month.

    1. Is it a poem, a prose poem, a memoir, a short story? Does the genre matter?
    2. Does it evoke memories of your own childhood Christmases?
    3. Any favourite lines or episodes. Were there any that you would have like to have seen developed more, or would that ruin the atmosphere that Dylan evokes.
    4. If you are familiar with Dylan's work, how do you think it compares with his other work?
    5. Anything else you'd like to add?

    Any other favourite Christmas poems?

  • MiliMili Shipmate
    I have been really busy with Christmas stuff, but today found out I was a close contact of someone with Covid so have to isolate until I get a negative PCR test which is impossible today with centres closed for Christmas or already at capacity, so now have time I didn't want. No Christmas get together for me this year, though my home test was negative and I'm two weeks from my booster shot so praying I stay negative! At least I can still eat Christmas food, unlike the year I had my appendix out on Christmas Eve.

    1. Is it a poem, a prose poem, a memoir, a short story? Does the genre matter?

    I considered it a poem, but never noticed that when I watched the T.V. adaption as a child.

    2. Does it evoke memories of your own childhood Christmases?

    It reminded me of the T.V. adaption and I was happy to find and rewatch it online for some nostalgia. Before we had a video player and when there were only 5 T.V. channels, Christmas T.V was exciting as you got to see your favourite shows and movies once a year. T.V. being such a big part of my childhood Christmas traditions is a change from the time the poem was written.

    3. Any favourite lines or episodes. Were there any that you would have like to have seen developed more, or would that ruin the atmosphere that Dylan evokes.

    I like the poem in its entirety, but still think I prefer watching the adaption to reading it, but that may be nostalgic bias. The bit with the lolly/candy cigarettes was funny and somewhat relatable. We had those in Australia sold as a slang word for cigarettes that also was a slur for gay men. They changed the name to Fads fun sticks and got rid of the red ends - I checked and they still sell them, but I don't think they are as popular nowadays. Better than flavoured vapes for children I guess.

    4. If you are familiar with Dylan's work, how do you think it compares with his other work?

    I should check out some of his other works.

    5. Anything else you'd like to add?

    As a child I thought Wales was part of England and this poem was set in England. Apologies to any Welsh people reading!

    I don't remember 'The Snowman' being big in Australia, though I had read the book, but I loved the accompanying song and film clip as sung by Aled Jones (rather than Peter Auty who sang for the animation). I also didn't know Jones was Welsh. I also watched a documentary on Jones where the adults were all worried about what would happen when his voice broke and if his career would be over. Once my parents explained what this meant I was so concerned that I prayed to God for him to not lose his singing career and be sad! I'm happy that prayer was answered! So Wales added to the joy of my Australian Christmas, but I did not know it was the nation of Wales I had to thank. Thank-you Wales!
  • MooMoo Kerygmania Host
    I love the poem because it evokes the feelings and experiences of childhood, such as doing something entirely innocent in hopes that the adults will call you down for it. Then you can triumphantly proclaim your innocence.
  • jedijudyjedijudy Heaven Host
    This is the first time I've read this poem/story. It was very interesting and really evoked a feeling of a child's feelings and observations.

    I'll be adding it to my Christmas story collection.

    And, I'm very grateful for this book group introducing me to many books I've not read before. All Seated on the Ground is now a Christmas favorite because of you all, and I think A Child's Christmas in Wales will join the list of favorite Christmas readings.
  • SarasaSarasa All Saints Host
    That's one of the things I really like about the Ship's book group, reading books you wouldn't have normally. For me the real eye-opener was A Christmas Carol. I thought it would be sentimental and lightweight, but the social commentary is still relevant today.

    I enjoyed A Child's Christmas in Wales,. The language on the whole draws you in and I liked the way it seamlessly moved from incident to incident. Some of it felt a little studied, the snowing for 12 days when her was six or vice versa didn't seem a 'true' memory in the way some of the other incidents, such as the sweet cigarette smoking did. I think pretending they were real cigarettes is something anyone born before about 1960 did some time in their childhood. I liked all the aunts and uncles in the kitchen too. I remember adults being different at that time of year, back then alcohol (and chicken/turkey) was very much something for special occasion
    I must say I was a bit disappointed in the reading of the poem by Thomas I came across. I thought he'd sound more Welsh than he actually did.
  • Thomas has a kind of BBC Welsh accent. His father was an English teacher and quite severe. He was also concerned that his son's prospects would be damaged if he had a strong Swansea accent so arranged elocution lessons.

    Thomas's work is always over-written. He was drunk on words.

    He was drunk on booze too, but that's another story.

    His childhood reminiscences and short pieces are all worthwhile, as is 'Under Milk Wood' his 'drama for voices'.

    His poetry varies. It can be stodgy. There are about six stand-out poems I reckon - 'Fernhill' for one. 'Do Not Go Gentle' has to be the best villanelle in the language though ...

    And there are occasions when only 'And Death Shall Have No Dominion' will do. I read it at my wife's funeral, but closed with T S Eliot.
  • MooMoo Kerygmania Host
    I like "Refusal to Mourn the Death by Fire of a Child".
  • Not one of my favourite Thomas poems, but hey ...
  • I found it incredibly vivid. I could imaginae a young child perceiving one's uncles and aunts in the manner in which they were portrayed.
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