Oops - your Trump presidency discussion thread.

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  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    No. We really need to be careful not to er, "step in the shit" of those who mess with the truth on a regular basis, as a colorful Vietnamese metaphor puts it.

    And wasn't you who said I could not take a joke?
  • mousethiefmousethief Shipmate
    Gramps49 wrote: »
    No. We really need to be careful not to er, "step in the shit" of those who mess with the truth on a regular basis, as a colorful Vietnamese metaphor puts it.

    And wasn't you who said I could not take a joke?

    Telling an untruth and then trying to pass it off as a joke is a bad joke indeed.
  • No, it was I who identified a particular joke that apparently whizzed right past your ear. On a different thread.

    Do you mean to tell me that your previous post on THIS thread, which I took to be a flat statement of fact--as I understand others also did--was in fact a joke?

    But leaving that aside, to your second-last post: No, an emoticon is NOT sufficient in and of itself to signal "this flat statement is in fact a joke and not true in itself."

    Good grief, man, I read what you said and reported it to my son as straight fact. And why? Because it's precisely the kind of thing Trump WOULD do.

    If you'd said it of Jimmy Carter, now, no emoticon would be needed.

    Saying it of Trump is so close to what he would do, that the entire load of emojis ever created would not be sufficient to raise a doubt. You'd pretty much have to say "THIS IS A JOKE" in flaming letters a mile high.
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    I have seen Croesus's story about Kushner, and it is truly appalling. It needs to be shouted from the rafters. I'm only sorry that it didn't come out in about 80 days from now.

    But the thing I missed, and which is also tremendously concerning, is this bit:
    Meanwhile, Dr. Deborah Birx, the White House’s coronavirus response coordinator, was reportedly sharing models with senior staff that optimistically — and erroneously, it would turn out — predicted the virus would soon fade away.

    This gives Trump some cover for their earlier decisions, I reckon. Obviously not the decision to let blue states suffer, but others perhaps. I would like to see Blix grilled about this.
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    In other words, Lamb Chopped, you just got punked.

    Think of the absurdity of the statement.

    The Rolling Stones are obviously English.

    Moving on....
  • mousethiefmousethief Shipmate
    You know the Rolling Stones are English. It does not follow from this that Trump does. What else you got?
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    C'mon Gramps. This is the President who thought a major US city in the midwest was in another state. It is totally believable that he thought the Stones were from New England.
  • BoogieBoogie Shipmate
    It’s a version of Poe’s law.

    Trump is so mind bogglingly thick that we believe that he did say any ridiculous thing.

    If anyone else said it we’d say ‘really?’ and then check. But he says things like this every day, so why go to snopes?

  • BroJamesBroJames Purgatory Host, 8th Day Host
    Boogie wrote: »
    <snip> But he says things like this every day, so why go to snopes?

    Indeed. Actually my search was prompted by wondering if the Stones had responded, and it immediately brought up links to the fact checking website.

    While the underlying idea is both funny and plausible, I’d rather minimise any actually fake stories otherwise he’ll use their existence as a smokescreen for the real rubbish.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Simon Toad wrote: »
    I have seen Croesus's story about Kushner, and it is truly appalling. It needs to be shouted from the rafters. I'm only sorry that it didn't come out in about 80 days from now.

    I don't think it will have much effect. Most diehard MAGA-types will assume it's all just Deep State media lies.

  • mousethiefmousethief Shipmate
    stetson wrote: »
    Simon Toad wrote: »
    I have seen Croesus's story about Kushner, and it is truly appalling. It needs to be shouted from the rafters. I'm only sorry that it didn't come out in about 80 days from now.

    I don't think it will have much effect. Most diehard MAGA-types will assume it's all just Deep State media lies.

    They are perfectly inoculated against the truth, even the anti-vaxxers.
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    edited August 2
    Yeah, but if his support is whittled down to them, the election will be a walkover. He needs the anti-Clinton moderates. Plus, I'm interested in the extent to which people like Blix were corrupted or pressured into fudging stuff for the bastard.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Simon Toad wrote: »
    Yeah, but if his support is whittled down to them, the election will be a walkover.

    Probably. Unless he can work some kind of electoral college magic.

  • W HyattW Hyatt Shipmate
    Crœsos wrote: »
    Vanity Fair published an article recently about the Jared Kushner directed group trying to come up with a federal testing plan.

    ...
    ...

    Most troubling of all, perhaps, was a sentiment the expert said a member of Kushner’s team expressed: that because the virus had hit blue states hardest, a national plan was unnecessary and would not make sense politically. “The political folks believed that because it was going to be relegated to Democratic states, that they could blame those governors, and that would be an effective political strategy,” said the expert.

    That logic may have swayed Kushner. “It was very clear that Jared was ultimately the decision maker as to what [plan] was going to come out,” the expert said.

    So if this article is correct, the Trump administration* decided to ignore COVID-19 and sabotage testing because the virus was killing all the "right people".

    The article has been edited to include pro forma denials by White House spokesperson and serial fabulist Kayleigh McEnany.

    I'm x-posting this over in Hell because the U.S. government consigning its own citizens to death and suffering for political advantage seems like it might merit some strong language and colorful responses.

    I'd say this is in contention for one of the most damning reports yet about the administration*. But at the same time, I'd almost be surprised to find out that they hadn't made their decisions based on some similar calculations.
  • Simon Toad wrote: »
    C'mon Gramps. This is the President who thought a major US city in the midwest was in another state. It is totally believable that he thought the Stones were from New England.

    I don't think it entered his head to consider where they were from, seriously. "Un-American" to him means "bad and resists what I want." He's lost sight of the geographical reference, if indeed he ever had that connection. I would have no trouble believing it if you told me that he'd tried to compliment Putin by calling him a "real American guy."

    The fact that we find it laughable does NOT mean we recognized that it is factually untrue. If you'd said it of Obama, we'd recognize that. But Trump routinely turns reality into a pretzel. Among a million pretzels, spotting the fake is pretty much impossible.

  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    Having nowhere else to put this. Trump's younger brother, Dennis, has died. Trump had called Dennis his best (and probably only) friend. Where was Trump when he was told of his brother's death? If you guessed on a golf course, you are right.

    So much for family loyalty. Someone's blood is not as thick as water.

    Condolences to the (real) family of Dennis.
  • Being fair about this, it is not easy to tell exactly when someone will take their last breath, esp. if they've been sick for months. And my guess would be that for Trump, golfing IS how he copes with bad feelings.
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    edited August 18
    Golf is great for relaxing and de-stressing if you don't care about your scorecard. I'm not going to trash Trump over his brother's death. All I do is fantasise about him having a catastrophic stroke and existing in a state of conscious death. But I do it for the right reasons. :wink:
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    I am going to correct myself. The name of the brother was Robert S.Trump, not Dennis. He apparently had a recent fall and had some brain bleeds. He had been on a blood thinner for some time.

    Donald saw him on Friday.
    On Saturday, Donald called the hospital to see how Dennis was doing. He called from his New Jersey Golf Club.
    Robert died Sunday morning. Don was golfing.

    Now, it would seem to me, if Donald called Saturday and was told Robert was failing, why would Don be on the fairway the next morning?

    I admit this is speculation on my part.
  • Simon ToadSimon Toad Shipmate
    edited August 18
    Not everybody can take being at the bedside. People react differently to bereavement, even asshole presidents. But surely you know this. I can't complain about Trump hatred getting the better of us. See previous post.
  • You don't always get told "he's failing." They told me my father was recovering surprisingly well, which is why I was still curling my hair when he died.

    It's not an easy thing to predict, much of the time,
  • And T may simply not be able to deal with that kind of thing,
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    So the U.S. Senate released Volume Five [PDF] of their (heavily redacted) report on Russian interference in the 2016 election. For those who don't have time to wade through nearly a thousand pages of report, some of the more interesting points are summarized by this Twitter thread. Some bits that caught my eye:
    • [ Konstantin ] "Kilimnik is a Russian intelligence officer." That's a direct quote from the report. Yeah, we all pretty much worked from that assumption but the Senate is willing to state it baldly in the unredacted part of its report. For those who don't remember, he's the one who had a lot of contact with Trump campaign manager (and current federal inmate) Paul Manafort 35207-016, including one incident where Manafort shared Trump campaign internal data with Kilimnik.
    • Kilimnik may have been connected with the GRU hack-and-release operation against the DNC.
    • Contrary to Wikileaks' assertions, there is significant evidence that they were knowingly working with Russian government officials.
    • Michael Cohen 86067-054 discussed the possibility of a presidential pardon several times with Jay Sekulow (Trump's personal attorney) and Cohen's understanding was that such discussions originated with Trump.
    • On the day of the release of the Access Hollywood tape, Roger Stone told Jerome Corsi to "drop the Posdesta emails". Shortly thereafter, Wikileaks published hacked DNC emails from (among others) John Podesta.

    In conclusion, this is all perfectly normal and anyone who says otherwise is fake news. [/sarcasm]
  • love the prison numbers. If only there was a number for the bastard Stone.
  • To be fair to Trump, when my mother was dying I asked the rather experienced nurses how long did they think that she might last. Perhaps as long as three or four days. She was dead 12 hours later.
  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth 8th Day Host, Mystery Worship Editor
    My condolences, but how could they answer with absolute certainty a question like that?

    Meanwhile, you'll note that you-know-who is busy making arrangements for his brother, resting in the bosom of his family and giving them comfort, being there at this sad time . . . NOT!
  • Oh, they couldn't, and said as much. My point is merely that Robert Trump's team may have said something that was open to interpretation and Donald zigged when he should have zagged. Yes, I am being charitable.
  • T has publicly floated the idea of holding a memorial for his brother at the White House on Friday. Dunno whether that's going forward, or how the rest of the family feels.
  • I visited my grandfather in hospital, and asked if he was dying. I was told that he wasn't. I phoned my father and aunt to come ASAP (both lived a couple of hours from the hospital). My father came. My aunt checked with the hospital and was told that he was not dying, and that I had been told he was not dying.

    He died that evening.

    In fairness, looking at his charts he was still doing well, but I knew my grandfather, I could see that the light had gone out of his eyes, and that the end was near.
  • Graven ImageGraven Image Shipmate
    edited August 19
    I do not believe we have any say in how another person deals with the death of a loved one or how they show grief. IMHO it really is none of our business.
  • HugalHugal Shipmate
    Unless Trump decides to make political capital out of it. I would not put it past him
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    On Robert Trump
    He was such a great guy because he was not jealous of my greatness.
    (DT)

    Trump is now telling people to not by Goodyear Tires because the company will not allow their employees to wear political attire like his MAGA hats. Problem is Goodyear is based in Tupelo, OH. One of the critical swing states DT would need to win And Goodyear makes the tires that the presidential limousine uses exclusively.
  • Wonder if the union workers at Goodyear are Teamsters? The Teamsters Union has already endorsed Biden.
  • Gramps49 wrote: »
    Trump is now telling people to not by Goodyear Tires because the company will not allow their employees to wear political attire like his MAGA hats. Problem is Goodyear is based in Tupelo, OH.
    I think you mean Akron, Ohio.

  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth 8th Day Host, Mystery Worship Editor
    Goodyear used to be headquartered in Arizona. There is a city named Goodyear where the plant and its cotton plantations once stood. I believe ties and memories are still strong.
  • Twitter going potty, or the lefty part of it, as Steve Bannon is arrested for fraud over Trumps wall, or rather, a "build the wall campaign". Expect Trump to state, "I didn't know him very well".
  • PS, Bannon was apparently arrested by agents of US Postal Service. Oh irony, shall I fly to thee on wings of hazy gauze?
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Twitter going potty, or the lefty part of it, as Steve Bannon is arrested for fraud over Trumps wall, or rather, a "build the wall campaign".

    From the SDNY website:
    Leaders Of ‘We Build The Wall’ Online Fundraising Campaign Charged With Defrauding Hundreds Of Thousands Of Donors
    ·
    Brian Kolfage, Stephen Bannon, and Two Others Alleged to Have Funneled Hundreds of Thousands of Dollars From the Organization to Kolfage; All Four Defendants Allegedly Profited From Their Roles in the Scheme

    Audrey Strauss, the Acting United States Attorney for the Southern District of New York, and Philip R. Bartlett, Inspector-in-Charge of the New York Field Office of the United States Postal Inspection Service (“USPIS”), announced the unsealing of an indictment charging BRIAN KOLFAGE, STEPHEN BANNON, ANDREW BADOLATO, and TIMOTHY SHEA for their roles in defrauding hundreds of thousands of donors in connection with an online crowdfunding campaign known as “We Build the Wall” that raised more than $25 million. The defendants were arrested this morning.

    <snip>

    Acting U.S. Attorney Audrey Strauss said: “As alleged, the defendants defrauded hundreds of thousands of donors, capitalizing on their interest in funding a border wall to raise millions of dollars, under the false pretense that all of that money would be spent on construction. While repeatedly assuring donors that Brian Kolfage, the founder and public face of We Build the Wall, would not be paid a cent, the defendants secretly schemed to pass hundreds of thousands of dollars to Kolfage, which he used to fund his lavish lifestyle. We thank the USPIS for their partnership in investigating this case, and we remain dedicated to rooting out and prosecuting fraud wherever we find it.”

    You can find more details and the charging documents at the link, for those who are interested.
    Expect Trump to state, "I didn't know him very well".

    And that he's shocked to learn that there's gambling grifting going on here.
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Expect Trump to state, "I didn't know him very well".

    And here it is:
    President Donald Trump said on Thursday he feels “very badly” about the arrest of his former close adviser Steve Bannon but knows nothing about the fundraising organization involved in the federal criminal case.

    “I do think it’s a sad event,” Trump told reporters in the Oval Office. “I haven’t dealt with him at all now for years, literally years.”

    Bannon, an architect of the nationalist populism that has defined Trump’s presidency, has been charged with defrauding Trump supporters in a campaign to help build the president’s signature wall along the U.S.-Mexico border.

    “I feel very badly. I haven’t been dealing with him for a long period of time,” Trump said.

    <snip>

    “I know nothing about the project other than I didn’t like, when I read about it, I didn’t like it. I said, ‘This is for government, this isn’t for private people,’ and it sounded to me like showboating,” Trump said.

    The Republican president also told reporters that he did not know the three charged along with Bannon and did not believe he had ever met them.
  • You know, I gather that T dealt (or had to deal with) The Mob when he was doing real estate development in New York. (From what I've heard, it's a necessary part of the process.)

    I wonder what they think of all his crimes and machinations?
  • Golden Key wrote: »
    You know, I gather that T dealt (or had to deal with) The Mob when he was doing real estate development in New York. (From what I've heard, it's a necessary part of the process.)

    I wonder what they think of all his crimes and machinations?

    They admire him for getting away with it so brazenly, I imagine.
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Golden Key wrote: »
    You know, I gather that T dealt (or had to deal with) The Mob when he was doing real estate development in New York. (From what I've heard, it's a necessary part of the process.)

    An Atlantic City casino owner with ties to the Mob? Unprecedented!?!

    An interesting connection in this project/alleged scam has emerged.
    So far, We Build the Wall and private contractor Tommy Fisher have put up four miles of private border fence in New Mexico and Texas. That might not seem like a lot, but the slow-going hasn’t tempered their forecasts for 2020.

    “We can build 200 miles privately right now in the State of Texas if the president gives us the green light,” Kolfage recently told Fox News.

    In quieter moments, Kolfage acknowledges that he’d need more than just a green light. He’d also need greenbacks — billions of dollars in government funding to make Trump’s wall happen. Kolfage’s organization, which has raised more than $25 million in online donations over the past year, has already spent nearly half their nest egg, he said.

    “By the end of 2020, we could be looking at close to 10 miles [of new border wall] with what we have in the bank,” Kolfage said. Yet even that could be a stretch; the first 4 miles of private wall cost Kolfage and Fisher more than $50 million, most of which was fronted by Fisher.

    So who is the very generous Tommy Fisher? Well . . .
    President Trump has personally and repeatedly urged the head of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers to award a border wall contract to a North Dakota construction firm whose top executive is a GOP donor and frequent guest on Fox News, according to four administration officials.

    In phone calls, White House meetings and conversations aboard Air Force One during the past several months, Trump has aggressively pushed Dickinson, N.D.-based Fisher Industries to Department of Homeland Security leaders and Lt. Gen. Todd Semonite, the commanding general of the Army Corps, according to the administration officials, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive internal discussions. The push for a specific company has alarmed military commanders and DHS officials.

    <snip>

    Even as Trump pushes for his firm, Fisher already has started building a section of fencing in Sunland Park, N.M. We Build the Wall, a nonprofit that includes prominent conservatives who support the president — its associates and advisory board include former White House adviser Stephen K. Bannon, Blackwater USA founder Erik Prince, ex-congressman Tom Tancredo and former Kansas secretary of state Kris Kobach — has guided an effort to build portions of the border barrier on private land with private funds.

    Kris Kobach is also the general counsel for We Build The Wall. Kobach was recently ordered by a judge to take some remedial legal training because he didn't seem to know what he was doing during trial, so their legal defense is likely to be . . . interesting.
  • Why do I suspect that any and all landowners--especially Native Americans--who were inconvenienced, overridden, had their land used/taken without their permission--will be more than happy to testify at any trials...?
  • Here is a special little tune for Trump's little mate and reputed World of Warcraft market manipulator, Mr Steven Bannon. A little premature, but you have to get in quick with Barr's justice department.

    In the Jailhouse Now - Tim Blake Nelson
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    The National Post(basically, a conservative opinion journal masquerading as a daily newspaper) is claiming that parts of Biden's acceptance speech were lifted from the deathbed farewell of Jack Layton, former leader of Canada's NDP.

    From my brief scan, it seemed like the alleged lift involved fairly generic phrases, and even then, Biden wasn't quoting the lines word for word.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Sorry, I meant to post that on the election thread. I'll repost it when I'm at a laptop later.
  • United States Postal Inspection Service (“USPIS”), announced the unsealing of an indictment charging BRIAN KOLFAGE, STEPHEN BANNON, ANDREW BADOLATO, and TIMOTHY SHEA for their roles in defrauding hundreds of thousands of donors in connection with an online crowdfunding campaign known as “We Build the Wall” that raised more than $25 million.

    Cheezy-whizz ! What career would a guy named "BADOLATO" get into, other than crime? There's got to be a song in this. "Andy Badolato is the crook for me". And next is "We built the wall--we watched it fall
    - - into yer bank account
    [I know. Purgatory is for serious discussion.]
  • Re possibility of Trump refusing to leave the White House if he loses:

    "Top general says no role for military in presidential vote" (Politico and AP, via Yahoo).

    The "top general" is Gen. Mark Milley, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and who is "known to be a student of military and constitutional history". Two members of the House Armed Services Committee put questions to him in writing, and he responded in writing.

    Good read, IMHO.
  • Meanwhile does anyone know what movie Trump watched that made him think a plane load of secret agents lurking in dark shadows were coming to hurt him? You can't make this stuff up it's so weird.

    Snakes on a Plane and Sharknado perhaps?
  • CrœsosCrœsos Shipmate
    Meanwhile does anyone know what movie Trump watched that made him think a plane load of secret agents lurking in dark shadows were coming to hurt him? You can't make this stuff up it's so weird.

    Facebook conspiracy theory.
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