Fuck this fucking virus with a fucking farm implement.

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Comments

  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    He’s a fuckwit and is only one notch above your(?) fearless leader
  • SojournerSojourner Shipmate
    And he ain’t funny
  • Here's what's happening here.

    "Hello we're taking your loved one /off a breathing machine /out of the ICU/ because we think they're going to die and we're giving it to someone else"

    It's totally the gov't fault. Which discontinued all restrictions including masks July 11. Refused up to a week ago to reconsider. Restrictions and vaccine passports ordered now. After its far far too late.

    https://twitter.com/GregFingas/status/1439431483110924293?s=20
  • HuiaHuia Shipmate
    I am sorry to hear that NP.

    Lack of ventilators and ICU beds is the reason that NZ initially went early and hard. Then Delta came along. At the moment community cases are restricted to Auckland, (largest city). An SOS call to health workers in other centres to volunteer to provide back up for exhausted workers in Auckland has had a good response.
  • DooneDoone Shipmate
    So sorry, @NOprophet_NØprofit 😢
  • So, I work at a facility for disabled adults. And, because such places are hard to work for and not the most lucrative, there's always a struggle to attract and retain staff.

    Recently, our president, for very good reasons, is mandating vaccination. And this is well and good. The primary reason this fucking virus is still circulating is because people are refusing to get vaccinated. So, because people are too paranoid and fear-addled to get their shots, we have to whip out the arm of the state. And even if the Fed can't do it, I'm sure our loud and proud progressive governor will make a similar call in our state. Good for him.

    In case it's not obvious, I'm past entertaining anti-vax arguments. I struggle to find sympathy with anti-vax anecdotes or sentiments like "I got the shot and was sick for two weeks" or "I'm scared to get the shot." And I usually find it relatively easy to sympathize with people even if they're wrong. It's getting tiresome.

    But my current beef is that my employer, because they struggle already to attract and retain staff, is likely going to lose a bunch of staff because of cowards and paranoiacs who are more afraid of the side effects of a vaccine than they are of a virus that has already been shown to be a killer. Watch people get et by the dragon because you're afraid of the slayer's sword?

    And it's likely going to make work life a lot harder for those of us who have had the sense to act like responsible adults.

    *grumbles*
  • MaryLouiseMaryLouise Purgatory Host, Epiphanies Host
    @Bullfrog I'm with you. My partner works in geriatric healthcare and has zero sympathy for anti-vaxxers. She keeps pointing out that people (elderly, young, fit, stubborn, wellness advocates etc) don't know they're vulnerable until they're on a ventilator in ICU.
  • BullfrogBullfrog Shipmate
    edited September 19
    MaryLouise wrote: »
    @Bullfrog I'm with you. My partner works in geriatric healthcare and has zero sympathy for anti-vaxxers. She keeps pointing out that people (elderly, young, fit, stubborn, wellness advocates etc) don't know they're vulnerable until they're on a ventilator in ICU.

    If this were a damning offense, there'd be a special corner of hell for healthcare workers who swallow and disseminate this nonsense.
  • HuiaHuia Shipmate
    It doesn't seem to have occurred to someone in our judicial system the letting someone out on bail who had covid, into a district that was covid free was not a Good Idea. The address he was bailed to has children at the local school - which is now closed.

    I am expecting alert levels rises to be announced later today for a larger chunk of the North Island, and not fall further for the South Island.
  • MaryLouise wrote: »
    @Bullfrog I'm with you. My partner works in geriatric healthcare and has zero sympathy for anti-vaxxers. She keeps pointing out that people (elderly, young, fit, stubborn, wellness advocates etc) don't know they're vulnerable until they're on a ventilator in ICU.

    Yes, this. If they were only putting themselves at risk, I'd shrug and say "well, OK then" - rather like my attitude towards motorcyclists who choose not to wear protective helmets. If you want to trade an increased risk of death, paralysis, or other poor outcome in an accident for the feel of the wind in your hair, that's your choice.

    This isn't about you - it's about the community. By not getting vaccinated, by not wearing a mask, by not taking sensible precautions to minimize the contact that you have with other people, you put everyone else at risk. And a lot of those people are much more vulnerable than you are.
  • RuthRuth Shipmate
    I'd point out though that someone has to scrape the dead motorcyclist off the street, or pay for all the care they'll require if they live, not to mention the harm done to anyone who loves and/or depends on them.

    But yeah, the anti-vaxxers are worse. The facility my mom lives in is requiring their workers to be vaccinated, thank goodness. I think they should require it of the residents as well, though there are very few holdouts. I have a feeling the contracts they have with residents have no applicable provision for requiring vaccination.
  • HugalHugal Shipmate
    There do seem to be more and louder antivaxers in Australia, NZ and the US. Over here in Blighty it is not as prominent. It happens but it is not as many percentage wise and not reported that much so not given that much airtime. I was ill with both shots, but it is worth it.
  • Hugal wrote: »
    There do seem to be more and louder antivaxers in Australia, NZ and the US. Over here in Blighty it is not as prominent. It happens but it is not as many percentage wise and not reported that much so not given that much airtime. I was ill with both shots, but it is worth it.

    Not sure that's true. They've been out in-force in our city centre.

    I've got zero patience with their arrogance. Covid doesn't take care about their diet, level of fitness, superior feelings or well-worded arguments. It just infects them and through them, others.
  • Sad but slightly mysterious case in Northern Ireland. I say mysterious because it is still unclear if this unfortunate man was himself an anti-vaxxer, or had in fact taken his jags but still continued, as a vaccine cynic, to retweet and share posts about the inefficacy and dangers of vaccines. My instinct is that if he had been vaccinated his family and friends would've been quick to say so.

    I think it's also noticeable that so far as I can see his DUP colleagues and other associates have not done what many people have done who have watched anti-vax friends die of Covid, which is to urge the public to get their jags as soon as possible, so as not to suffer the same fate. Again, this might be because it would appear to lend credence to the possibility/probability that Mr Hamill hadn't been vaccinated, which if true, seems to be an admission they are very keen to avoid.
  • HuiaHuia Shipmate
    Huia wrote: »
    It doesn't seem to have occurred to someone in our judicial system the letting someone out on bail who had covid, into a district that was covid free was not a Good Idea. The address he was bailed to has children at the local school - which is now closed.

    I am expecting alert levels rises to be announced later today for a larger chunk of the North Island, and not fall further for the South Island.

    I got this wrong. Later information said that the man broke the bail conditions he was set. He was meant to stop only if absolutely necessary on the way to the place he was being bailed to, but stopped 3 times. It is now thought he picked up COVID at one of those stops.

    This means that the area he is bailed to has moved to Level 4, while Auckland will move down to level 3, which Galloping Granny described accurately All Saints as "Level 4 with takeaways."
  • Anselmina wrote: »
    Sad but slightly mysterious case in Northern Ireland. I say mysterious because it is still unclear if this unfortunate man was himself an anti-vaxxer, or had in fact taken his jags but still continued, as a vaccine cynic, to retweet and share posts about the inefficacy and dangers of vaccines. My instinct is that if he had been vaccinated his family and friends would've been quick to say so.

    I think it's also noticeable that so far as I can see his DUP colleagues and other associates have not done what many people have done who have watched anti-vax friends die of Covid, which is to urge the public to get their jags as soon as possible, so as not to suffer the same fate. Again, this might be because it would appear to lend credence to the possibility/probability that Mr Hamill hadn't been vaccinated, which if true, seems to be an admission they are very keen to avoid.

    That and the fact that his views may not be untypical of their base and they don't want to alienate them. Because votes.
  • There won't be many votes left, if their base dies of Covid... :disappointed:

    I do have some sympathy for those who, for good medical reasons, can't be vaccinated. The way things are going, their lives are likely to be even more restricted than they are now, IYSWIM.



  • Meanwhile, the number of Covid cases in schools in England rises - just as predicted:
    https://theguardian.com/education/2021/sep/21/more-than-100000-pupils-off-school-in-england-last-week-amid-covid-surge

    But...but...Beloved Leader said it was all over, and gave us *Freedom Day*, didn't he? Did our Beloved Leader lie to us?
    :flushed:

  • Meanwhile, the number of Covid cases in schools in England rises - just as predicted:

    Our local schools seem to be making plans to introduce a testing regime for people who are deemed "close contacts" of covid-positive kids, with the aim of reducing the number of kids who are sent home to quarantine. Keeping kids in school is a good goal, and usually better for their education than at-home learning, but they're being a bit coy about the numbers and the risk assessments. My school district has about 25,000 kids, and is seeing about 30 cases a week. By eye, there are more cases in elementary schools (where none of the kids are vaccinated). The district doesn't split up cases by vaccination status, but I'm willing to bet that most of the high school cases are in unvaccinated kids (vaccine uptake here is about 50% in that age group).

    I'm hoping we'll have vaccine authorisation for elementary aged kids by the end of the year, which should help.
  • Just as a reminder that this effing thing is still with us:

    https://theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/02/portsmouth-teenager-dies-of-covid-on-day-she-was-due-to-get-vaccine

    A sad story. to say the least.
  • Oh, that is heartbreaking.
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited October 4
    Indeed it is, and I was reminded of the continued presence of the Plague whilst shopping in Tesco today - surrounded by maskless Covidiots, mostly of the younger generation...

    This is not to cast ANY aspersions on the behaviour of Jorja Halliday or her family - after all, the poor lass was just about to be vaccinated...
  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth Mystery Worship Editor
    maskless Covidiots

    Love the coinage.
  • Our state is moving towards 'freedom day' next Monday at 70% double-vaccinated. Meanwhile, here in one of the poorest parts of the country [our town sits on the 91st decile of socioeconomic indices] the virus has arrived with a vengeance, seeded from a couple of McDonalds and supermarkets. Our vaccination rate is one of the lowest in the state having relied upon limited GP access and some pharmacy injections. The regional mass vaccination hub is an hour away by car and even further by public transport. Two eight-hour local walk-in centres last Friday and next are the sum total of any extra provision. Eighteen months of relative safety gone in the blink of an eye.
  • PomonaPomona Shipmate
    I have sympathy with Black and other minority vaccine-hesitant people, who undoubtedly have things like the Tuskegee Syphillis Experiment on their mind, and other ways in which their government experimented on minority groups. I'm not sure that a heavy-handed 'stick' approach is right when many groups have very legitimate reasons to be wary. A 'carrot' approach makes more sense to me. But I believe a lot of hesitancy amongst Christian minority groups comes from inaccurate propaganda about the vaccines containing aborted foetuses, some of that unfortunately coming from US RC clergy. Imo that should be grounds for defrocking.
  • Our state is moving towards 'freedom day' next Monday at 70% double-vaccinated. Meanwhile, here in one of the poorest parts of the country [our town sits on the 91st decile of socioeconomic indices] the virus has arrived with a vengeance, seeded from a couple of McDonalds and supermarkets. Our vaccination rate is one of the lowest in the state having relied upon limited GP access and some pharmacy injections. The regional mass vaccination hub is an hour away by car and even further by public transport. Two eight-hour local walk-in centres last Friday and next are the sum total of any extra provision. Eighteen months of relative safety gone in the blink of an eye.

    :disappointed:

    Why, you might almost have our Beloved Leader (or a clone thereof :scream: ) *in charge* of your state...

  • Pomona wrote: »
    But I believe a lot of hesitancy amongst Christian minority groups comes from inaccurate propaganda about the vaccines containing aborted foetuses, some of that unfortunately coming from US RC clergy.

    I've encountered a few of these folks, and they're the sort that don't think that RCs are any kind of Christian, and I haven't heard any mention of aborted foetuses (and given that this group also tends to be loudly anti-abortion, I'd probably have heard it). What I hear is a whole lot of "faith not fear" and "I'm going to trust God to keep me safe", with a side order of "the Democrats want to force you to have the vaccine, so it must be bad."

    I suspect we'll start hearing some "it's against my religion - I think it was developed with aborted foetus cells" type claims, because lots of employers are now requiring vaccines, but allowing some kind of religious exemption. So if you don't want to have the vaccine, and want to keep your job, you have to claim that it's against your religion to be vaccinated.
  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth Mystery Worship Editor
    Pomona wrote: »
    many groups have very legitimate reasons to be wary.

    They may have reasons, but I wouldn't call them legitimate.
    lots of employers are now requiring vaccines, but allowing some kind of religious exemption.

    I understand that in some cases the request for exemption can be denied.
  • I understand that in some cases the request for exemption can be denied.

    It can - but you have at least a possibility of getting an exemption, whereas without either a genuine medical exclusion or religious claim, you have no chance of getting an exemption.

  • PomonaPomona Shipmate
    @Amanda B Reckondwyth - unless you're part of a group that has been subject to medical experimentation by your own government, it's not for you to decide whether those who are have legitimate reasons to be wary or not. If I was in a group who had been used for medical experimentation by my own government, I think it would be extremely reasonable to hesitate to have a new vaccine that said government demanded I have or lose my job. I suggest you look up what the Tuskegee Syphillis Experiment involved. This is in living memory for Black Americans.

    I am fully vaxxed and of course understand the need for people working with vulnerable groups to be vaccinated. But punishing people for not being vaccinated is playing right into the hands of those who wish to promote anti-vaxx ideas.
  • PomonaPomona Shipmate
    Pomona wrote: »
    But I believe a lot of hesitancy amongst Christian minority groups comes from inaccurate propaganda about the vaccines containing aborted foetuses, some of that unfortunately coming from US RC clergy.

    I've encountered a few of these folks, and they're the sort that don't think that RCs are any kind of Christian, and I haven't heard any mention of aborted foetuses (and given that this group also tends to be loudly anti-abortion, I'd probably have heard it). What I hear is a whole lot of "faith not fear" and "I'm going to trust God to keep me safe", with a side order of "the Democrats want to force you to have the vaccine, so it must be bad."

    I suspect we'll start hearing some "it's against my religion - I think it was developed with aborted foetus cells" type claims, because lots of employers are now requiring vaccines, but allowing some kind of religious exemption. So if you don't want to have the vaccine, and want to keep your job, you have to claim that it's against your religion to be vaccinated.

    I was thinking of Cardinal Raymond Burke and his supporters, who very much are pushing the 'vaccines contain aborted foetuses' stance.
  • Marvin the MartianMarvin the Martian Admin Emeritus
    Pomona wrote: »
    I have sympathy with Black and other minority vaccine-hesitant people, who undoubtedly have things like the Tuskegee Syphillis Experiment on their mind, and other ways in which their government experimented on minority groups.

    OK, but surely the fact that the vaccine is being given to everybody - government included - should be enough to allay fears that this is such experimentation?
  • The issue is that for those with a community history of members of that community being unwilling participants in medical experimentation there is a distrust of the entire medical profession and the government - this is not entirely unreasonable given the community history. That makes members of that community more hesitant about any form of medical treatment than the wider population, and thus evidence to the contrary that convinces the majority that the vaccine is safe is going to convince a smaller proportion of that community. Simply because prior injustices have put the bar of how hard people need to work to gain trust higher than for communities without that history.
  • Amanda B ReckondwythAmanda B Reckondwyth Mystery Worship Editor
    Pomona wrote: »
    I suggest you look up what the Tuskegee Syphillis Experiment involved.

    I don't have to look it up. I am well aware of what the experiment involved.

    There is no comparison. On the one hand, we have a group of people who were not told what they were being infected with, were given false information about the length of the experiment, and were not given treatment even after treatment became readily available.

    On the other hand, we have a vaccine that has been extensively tested, subject to regulatory scrutiny, shown to be highly effective, and has been openly given to millions of people with a very small incidence of negative effects. Authority after authority has said that lessening of the pandemic is related to the number of people who receive the vaccine, and that if significant numbers remain unvaccinated, then the probability of new strains emerging that are resistant to the vaccine increases.

    That being the case, please don't tell me categorically that people who refuse the vaccine are acting legitimately.
  • If folk want to continue this tangent (on the history of vaccination and medical exploitation), I'm minded to split it off and move it to a more appropriate board. I'll see how it goes in the morning.

    DT
    HH
  • The idiot brigade is out today.

    https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/18/us/miami-private-school-students-covid-vaccine/index.html

    There seems to be a lot of magic woo involved here.


  • Just where do they get this rubbish from in the first place?

    O, I know - some weird (but plausible) site on the Magic Electrical Interweb.

    Anyone for Magic Woo? Roll up, roll up!
  • That shedding stuff was all over Twitter - all yelling in response to someone advising people to get vaccinated.
  • It sometimes seems to me that Farcebark, Tweeter, and the other Stuff with silly names, would have been better if they had never existed.
  • I don't know. Without Twitter, I wouldn't know some research I was involved with a few years back has just been published as a book, and I got an acknowledgement. Which cheered me up no end. (Or has until I actually read it - although I suspect it won't be too bad.)
  • At least anyone living in Miami knows what school not to send their children too. If the teachers consider uncritically reading this rubbish as "being informed" I'd hate to think what other rubbish they're teaching the kids.
  • Meanwhile, just as we in the Sunlit Uplands of England thought (or were told) the worst was over, along comes another variation on the theme:

    https://theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/19/fears-grow-in-england-over-rise-of-new-covid-delta-variant

    *sigh*
  • At least anyone living in Miami knows what school not to send their children too. If the teachers consider uncritically reading this rubbish as "being informed" I'd hate to think what other rubbish they're teaching the kids.

    There's a local "Green Earth" fair that I've been to a few times. About half the people there are fairly sensible environmentalists, and there are stalls about solar power, water conservation, green lawn care, and similar things. But there are also a lot of magic woo peddlers that hang out on the fringes - people selling foil phone guards so you can protect yourself from the microwaves that your phone emits, and the sort of people who will uncritically accept anything that's slightly unorthodox whilst assuming that anything mainstream is a conspiracy that's out to get them.

    I think this magic woo clan would fit in well at this school.
  • Meanwhile, just as we in the Sunlit Uplands of England thought (or were told) the worst was over, along comes another variation on the theme:

    https://theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/19/fears-grow-in-england-over-rise-of-new-covid-delta-variant

    *sigh*
    However, it is not yet considered a variant on concern https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-58965650
    There are dozens of variants around and when one becomes more common they watch it to see what happens. Most variants don't make a big impact, occasional ones, like Delta, do.
    The UK is the world leader in sequencing variants and we do 23% of global covid sequencing so are more likely to detect variants than other countries (even sometimes detecting other countries' variants). We do more sequencing than the US despite being much smaller https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01069-w
  • Meanwhile, just as we in the Sunlit Uplands of England thought (or were told) the worst was over, along comes another variation on the theme:

    https://theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/19/fears-grow-in-england-over-rise-of-new-covid-delta-variant

    *sigh*
    However, it is not yet considered a variant on concern https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-58965650
    There are dozens of variants around and when one becomes more common they watch it to see what happens. Most variants don't make a big impact, occasional ones, like Delta, do.
    The UK is the world leader in sequencing variants and we do 23% of global covid sequencing so are more likely to detect variants than other countries (even sometimes detecting other countries' variants). We do more sequencing than the US despite being much smaller https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01069-w

    OK - thanks @Heavenlyannie. I'm slightly reassured, I think...let's hope the new variety keeps itself to itself IYSWIM.
  • BoogieBoogie Shipmate
    Newspaper headline today “ Budget 2021: Sunak promises new post-Covid economy.”

    What is this ‘post Covid’ of which they speak?
  • A "post Covid economy" is one where we've adapted our societies to account for endemic coronavirus - so, when mixing working from home and in-office is normal for those jobs that don't absolutely require being at a particular place of work, where services have moved from providing coffee shops etc in town centres to serve lots of office workers to also provide services to home-workers, where the economics of running pubs and restaurants has shifted to providing lower density situations where customers have space to maintain physical distance, where hospital and other health and care providers are set up to have significant numbers of covid patients while also able to treat and care for everyone else, where schools can teach children without them sharing every germ they get with each other and hence their parents, ensuring that all workers have adequate support that they can afford to take sick leave especially if they have covid symptoms which includes decent wages and welfare support for the unemployed ....

    which means a budget that significantly increases funding for health and care services, to both build new covid facilities and train and employ more staff (properly paid), likewise schools so that classes can be smaller as the obvious way to increase physical distancing, investment in broadband to facilitate more home working, proper minimum wages and welfare support. And, taxing the rich to pay for it all.

    Fat chance of that happening. We'll have a budget that continues to burden the country with the costs of covid spending nothing to reduce those costs, and indeed putting in measures that increase those costs. Just as the government has done since Feb 2020.
  • Just the first two words - *Sunak promises* - are enough to make my heart sink.
  • PomonaPomona Shipmate
    At least anyone living in Miami knows what school not to send their children too. If the teachers consider uncritically reading this rubbish as "being informed" I'd hate to think what other rubbish they're teaching the kids.

    There's a local "Green Earth" fair that I've been to a few times. About half the people there are fairly sensible environmentalists, and there are stalls about solar power, water conservation, green lawn care, and similar things. But there are also a lot of magic woo peddlers that hang out on the fringes - people selling foil phone guards so you can protect yourself from the microwaves that your phone emits, and the sort of people who will uncritically accept anything that's slightly unorthodox whilst assuming that anything mainstream is a conspiracy that's out to get them.

    I think this magic woo clan would fit in well at this school.

    It's really frustrating - at least nowadays things like vegan food (am not vegan but am lactose intolerant so use dairy free stuff) is available in regular supermarkets, but running the Woo Gauntlet to get vegan/organic/legitimate herbalism or aromatherapy stuff etc is awful. The local independent health food shop is full of posters warning about 5G 🙁

    It's also alarming seeing how quickly this turns into naked ecofascism. I think in the UK there's a 'cosy' type of ecofascism that we're particularly prone too - this is related to my academic interests so I already have an interest in this, but my anti-fascist friends (who wouldn't ID as capital-A Antifa) are finding that it's a real problem.

    For me a big problem is that I don't know anyone who has died from this - one friend with pre-existing conditions was severely ill in hospital, but thankfully pulled through. Most people I know who had it were vaccinated quite early and have generally had it post-vaxx. The deaths of people I know have been due to other things. So I feel like I'm missing a key part of empathising with others. I don't know how to relate to people who have watched their loved ones die horribly, or attend funerals via zoom.
  • I had covid in early March 2020 and have long covid, or more correctly a post viral syndrome called postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome.
    When the pandemic hit last spring I was teaching a module on death and dying to frontline health care workers and residential care workers; a key theme being the concept of a good death. It was very upsetting for them.
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