I echo the regrets. There’s a quote from the movie “Lee” which has been with me in the latter stages of this race.
“Surely they can see what he is?”
Apparently not enough did.
Or not enough cared. Or, horrifyingly, enough wanted someone like that.
Or most people don't pay attention to politics most of the time, discount terrifying messaging, thought the economy was bad, and voted against an unpopular incumbent (whose party had been in power for 12 of the last 16 years).
Separately I suspect that while Gaza has salience only for a minority, the majority of people are somewhat discomfited whenever a foreign crisis seems to drag on.
I don't know what to say. Kahnke, the ex-pastor and Trump opponent who posts on youtube and who I have been banging on about here, said that if Trump were to be re-elected it would be because Christians decided that that should be the case - and that it would be to our lasting shame.
There will be blood-letting within the Democrat camp. Biden will be blamed. Harris may go.
Trump can be all bluster and may not follow through on some of his scarier promises, but he is in a stronger position this time and can pretty much do what he wants.
Separately I suspect that while Gaza has salience only for a minority, the majority of people are somewhat discomfited whenever a foreign crisis seems to drag on.
You think it was this and not racism and misogyny and most people's lack of understanding of how the economy works. Sure.
Separately I suspect that while Gaza has salience only for a minority, the majority of people are somewhat discomfited whenever a foreign crisis seems to drag on.
You think it was this and not racism and misogyny and most people's lack of understanding of how the economy works. Sure.
Separating people's professed reasons from their unspoken ones is a task for greater sages than any of us.
Latinas swung 16 points towards Trump. I don't know how to make sense of it.
Not sure there's a whole lot left to unpack at this point: not only is Harris a mediocre candidate who jumped into the race far too late, but it would be historically unprecedented for the incumbent party to hang on to the White House when the current President is as unpopular as Joe Biden is.
Some honest soul-searching from the Democratic party would be welcome now, but I'm not holding my breath.
Some honest soul-searching from the Democratic party would be welcome now, but I'm not holding my breath.
There will be endless soul-searching on the part of Democrats while Republicans burn down the world without giving their souls or others' any thought at all.
All many of us can do is to weep with those who weep.
Those who are rejoicing might do well to consider the possibility that the monstrosity they have unleashed upon the world may one day turn, and devour them.
Separately I suspect that while Gaza has salience only for a minority, the majority of people are somewhat discomfited whenever a foreign crisis seems to drag on.
You think it was this and not racism and misogyny and most people's lack of understanding of how the economy works. Sure.
As disquieting as the thought is, it seems that voters weren't motivated by issues, or if they were it was highly inconsistent. For example, the voters in Missouri just passed referendums protecting the right to abortion, raising the minimum wage, and requiring paid family leave. They also voted for a Senator and President who are opposed to those things and a governor and legislature that will most likely nullify the referendums like they did with Medicaid expansion. However American voters are making their decisions it's not on the basis of desired policy outcomes.
A bit early for a considered analysis but I’ve picked up a few clues. Trump seems to have picked up votes from the suburbs, from Latinos, from black men, from the under 30s. As well as solidifying his vote in the rural communities. Also there is some evidence that some women who were opposed to the abolition of Roe v Wade still voted for Trump.
I hate to draw any definitive conclusions from those trends but it seems reasonable to say that they don’t seem likely to have been policy driven.
I think that the left-leaning media were going off the deep end with Trump. Trump is at heart a narcissist. He wants to BE President, he doesnt want to actually do governing. That's why his first term had no wall built. He talks smack most of the time about policy.
His court cases are going to go away, Ukraine will fret a bit but I believe the well-paid defence contractors will see to his opinion there. Project 2025 was just a left-wing conspiracy theory.
What people wanted was a person who plainly isn't a Washington insider to make Washington insiders feel very, very uncomfortable. That why hewas elected in 2016 too.
Trevor Noah's most recent podcast had quite an enlightened discussion on this last week. Essentially, he pointed out that Trump is an inveterate liar who promised to do a load of stuff he almost certainly won't be able to do (make the greatest, bigliest economy ever, fix the wars and so on and so on). Harris sounded less appealing to some voters because she wasn't promising things she didn't believe she could deliver on.
I think that the left-leaning media were going off the deep end with Trump. Trump is at heart a narcissist. He wants to BE President, he doesnt want to actually do governing. That's why his first term had no wall built. He talks smack most of the time about policy.
This is incorrect. During his first term Trump made serious attempts at accomplishing most of his campaign agenda. He got Congress to appropriate a lot more money for physical barriers on the southern border. He enforced his Muslim ban. He came within one vote of repealing the Affordable Care Act.
Will he be more successful at implementing his campaign agenda this time around? I have no idea. But I do know that he will try, and the attempt will be very damaging whether it succeeds or not.
Maybe, but Trevor Noah makes a valid point. It remains to be seen as to what extent Trump succeeds in carrying out his threats, and there will surely be a great deal of resistance...
@Bishops Finger for you it's "they will resist." For many of us it's "Resist like the lives of yourself and those you love depends on it."
O yes indeed - I appreciate that, and can only dimly imagine what you're going through. There really are no words, so perhaps the fewer from this side of the Pond, the better.
Don't Mourn, Organize-Joe Hill. I hope my non-MAGA American friends do not give up the fight for basic human decency. As a Canadian living less than 60 miles from the border this feels much closer to home than it must for our friends across the Pond. We have our own federal election next year and many feel our Conservative party ( which will win power) is lead by Trump lite and using many of the same divisive tactics.
As I said last night, win or lose, the fight goes on. Trump is still a convicted felon. His health is not so good. The House has not been decided. Even if it goes Republican, we have a chance to realign congress in two years. The fight goes on.
It strikes me that the Democratic Party failed to take on board why Hillary Clinton lost in 2016, or to acknowledge the reluctance of so many to vote for Biden in 2020 which led to the mayhem after that election. Above all, they don't seem to have the faintest idea of what made Trump electable.
Trump doesn't care what the political insiders and commentators think, he just went out and appealed over their heads to the concerns of some voters which the "we know better" politicos rubbished as mad, bad, racist, ignorant, etc.
Until the political grandees of both parties get a proper handle on Trump's appeal they risk another like him not only standing in 2028 but winning.
Looks like a slightly edited copy-paste from the Brexit vote handwringing telling us why it was really our fault that a bunch of our compatriots decided to vote to screw us all.
All I can say to reassure you is that time and again, Americans have opted for the common good. Time and again, we have come to each other’s aid. We have resisted cruelty.
It strikes me that the Democratic Party failed to take on board why Hillary Clinton lost in 2016, or to acknowledge the reluctance of so many to vote for Biden in 2020 which led to the mayhem after that election. Above all, they don't seem to have the faintest idea of what made Trump electable.
Trump doesn't care what the political insiders and commentators think, he just went out and appealed over their heads to the concerns of some voters which the "we know better" politicos rubbished as mad, bad, racist, ignorant, etc.
Until the political grandees of both parties get a proper handle on Trump's appeal they risk another like him not only standing in 2028 but winning.
I think this is true. The Dem strategy against Trump has been, basically, how can anyone vote for this guy, and then they run on “we’re not Trump.” That has worked once.
Looks like a slightly edited copy-paste from the Brexit vote handwringing telling us why it was really our fault that a bunch of our compatriots decided to vote to screw us all.
I mean it’s the Democrats fault they lost the election. That seems obvious.
It strikes me that the Democratic Party failed to take on board why Hillary Clinton lost in 2016, or to acknowledge the reluctance of so many to vote for Biden in 2020 which led to the mayhem after that election. Above all, they don't seem to have the faintest idea of what made Trump electable.
Trump doesn't care what the political insiders and commentators think, he just went out and appealed over their heads to the concerns of some voters which the "we know better" politicos rubbished as mad, bad, racist, ignorant, etc.
Until the political grandees of both parties get a proper handle on Trump's appeal they risk another like him not only standing in 2028 but winning.
Does it strike you, @TheOrganist? Are you well and truly struck? Is there anything you can do to help us poor provincials? Does your gilded tower have stairs? Would you deign to descend, and let progressive Americans glean what they can from your crystalline analysis? What a gift that would be. Truly. Maybe you have a few spare throw pillows onto which we could stitch that last pearl of political wisdom re: 2028. Needle and thread, anyone? My sofa is going to be *so astute.*
That post may run somewhat afoul of Epiphanies Rules. If so, I apologize.
Actually - it doesn’t:
If it is not a lived reality for you, then consuming the occasional item in the media is no basis for discourse with people for whom prejudice is a daily lived reality - bear in mind these people have a right to be angry about misrepresentation and harm. For this reason and others, try to inform yourself about the issues before becoming involved in a discussion, listen with care to those who have lived this, and try to ensure your sources of information include the voices and experiences of people whose experiences and identities are bound up in the subject under discussion and are of high quality (see point 5).
Comments
“Surely they can see what he is?”
Apparently not enough did.
Or not enough cared. Or, horrifyingly, enough wanted someone like that.
What scares me is that they do see what he is which is why they vote for him
Or most people don't pay attention to politics most of the time, discount terrifying messaging, thought the economy was bad, and voted against an unpopular incumbent (whose party had been in power for 12 of the last 16 years).
There will be blood-letting within the Democrat camp. Biden will be blamed. Harris may go.
Trump can be all bluster and may not follow through on some of his scarier promises, but he is in a stronger position this time and can pretty much do what he wants.
Go where?
Oh well, it's one that won't bother us for much longer.
Just a factual point. CNN has just called Wisconsin for Trump, and consequentially Trump as President Elect.
You think it was this and not racism and misogyny and most people's lack of understanding of how the economy works. Sure.
Separating people's professed reasons from their unspoken ones is a task for greater sages than any of us.
Latinas swung 16 points towards Trump. I don't know how to make sense of it.
Some honest soul-searching from the Democratic party would be welcome now, but I'm not holding my breath.
There will be endless soul-searching on the part of Democrats while Republicans burn down the world without giving their souls or others' any thought at all.
Those who are rejoicing might do well to consider the possibility that the monstrosity they have unleashed upon the world may one day turn, and devour them.
As disquieting as the thought is, it seems that voters weren't motivated by issues, or if they were it was highly inconsistent. For example, the voters in Missouri just passed referendums protecting the right to abortion, raising the minimum wage, and requiring paid family leave. They also voted for a Senator and President who are opposed to those things and a governor and legislature that will most likely nullify the referendums like they did with Medicaid expansion. However American voters are making their decisions it's not on the basis of desired policy outcomes.
This.
God help us all.
I agree with Ruth and Croesos.
A bit early for a considered analysis but I’ve picked up a few clues. Trump seems to have picked up votes from the suburbs, from Latinos, from black men, from the under 30s. As well as solidifying his vote in the rural communities. Also there is some evidence that some women who were opposed to the abolition of Roe v Wade still voted for Trump.
I hate to draw any definitive conclusions from those trends but it seems reasonable to say that they don’t seem likely to have been policy driven.
His court cases are going to go away, Ukraine will fret a bit but I believe the well-paid defence contractors will see to his opinion there. Project 2025 was just a left-wing conspiracy theory.
What people wanted was a person who plainly isn't a Washington insider to make Washington insiders feel very, very uncomfortable. That why hewas elected in 2016 too.
Evidence for this claim?
This is incorrect. During his first term Trump made serious attempts at accomplishing most of his campaign agenda. He got Congress to appropriate a lot more money for physical barriers on the southern border. He enforced his Muslim ban. He came within one vote of repealing the Affordable Care Act.
Will he be more successful at implementing his campaign agenda this time around? I have no idea. But I do know that he will try, and the attempt will be very damaging whether it succeeds or not.
Here's Robert Reich in today's Guardian:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/06/election-trump-president-resistance-america
O yes indeed - I appreciate that, and can only dimly imagine what you're going through. There really are no words, so perhaps the fewer from this side of the Pond, the better.
Trump doesn't care what the political insiders and commentators think, he just went out and appealed over their heads to the concerns of some voters which the "we know better" politicos rubbished as mad, bad, racist, ignorant, etc.
Until the political grandees of both parties get a proper handle on Trump's appeal they risk another like him not only standing in 2028 but winning.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/nov/06/keir-starmer-congratulates-donald-trump-election-victory
He would probably have said much the same (albeit more warmly?) if Ms Harris had won.
Whether the special UK-US relationship survives intact remains, of course, to be seen.
Straight, white, cisgender, rich man who says: Except for all the times we haven't.
I think this is true. The Dem strategy against Trump has been, basically, how can anyone vote for this guy, and then they run on “we’re not Trump.” That has worked once.
I mean it’s the Democrats fault they lost the election. That seems obvious.
Does it strike you, @TheOrganist? Are you well and truly struck? Is there anything you can do to help us poor provincials? Does your gilded tower have stairs? Would you deign to descend, and let progressive Americans glean what they can from your crystalline analysis? What a gift that would be. Truly. Maybe you have a few spare throw pillows onto which we could stitch that last pearl of political wisdom re: 2028. Needle and thread, anyone? My sofa is going to be *so astute.*
Actually - it doesn’t:
My bold.
Yeah, @Thomas Rowans, you might scroll back up and attempt to digest @Nick Tamen's characterization of @TheOrganist's brain dump. It's spot on.