Comments

• Baptist Trainfan Shipmate

  September 14 edited September 14

  I think the service timing has more to do with what has gone before: Morning Prayer at 7.45am, Said Common Prayer Eucharist at 8am and Sung Eucharist with Junior Church at 9.30am. I'm actually a bit surprised that the 11.15am service isn't Mattins. I think refreshments are served between the 9.30 and 11.15 services, hopefully allowing the congregations to mingle.
• Spike Ecclesiantics & MW Host, Admin Emeritus

  September 14

  I’m curious about the beadle. Surely it was a verger, as would normally be the case in a cathedral.
• angloid Shipmate

  September 15

  Baptist Trainfan wrote: »

  I think the service timing has more to do with what has gone before: Morning Prayer at 7.45am, Said Common Prayer Eucharist at 8am and Sung Eucharist with Junior Church at 9.30am. I'm actually a bit surprised that the 11.15am service isn't Mattins. I think refreshments are served between the 9.30 and 11.15 services, hopefully allowing the congregations to mingle.

  
  At one time (fairly recently) there would be a good chance in a cathedral that one of the mid-morning services would be Mattins. I don't think that happens as much these days. As parish churches are increasingly (though thankfully not universally) tending to become clones of that place in Brompton, cathedrals seem to becoming more sacramental and, while not partisan anglo-catholic, recognisably mainstream Catholic such as any international traveller would recognise.
• Pomona Shipmate

  September 17

  In dioceses that lean Low Church for historical reasons, Anglican cathedrals are usually not all that sacramental - particularly ones without much of a choral history.
• angloid Shipmate

  September 17 edited September 17

  Pomona wrote: »

  In dioceses that lean Low Church for historical reasons, Anglican cathedrals are usually not all that sacramental - particularly ones without much of a choral history.

  
  Examples? The only one I can think of is Bradford, which is no longer 'the' cathedral of a diocese. I don't know what goes on in all cathedrals, but with that exception I think every C of E cathedral has a daily eucharist, and Choral Mattins on Sunday will be an 'extra' in the few places with the resources to provide it, alongside the main service of Choral Eucharist. Reservation of the Blessed Sacrament, and eucharistic vestments, appear to be the norm.
  
  Unless of course you are referring to Anglican cathedrals outside England? Ireland has a different history of course; Scotland and Wales are generally strongly sacramental. The USA does not even have a cathedral in every diocese so things might be different there. And of course Anglican traditions in much of the rest of the world seem to be more polarised.
• Bishops Finger Shipmate

  September 17 edited September 17

  My (admittedly limited) experience of cathedrals in England certainly chimes in with what @angloid says, and I can only think of Bradford as being particularly 'low'.
  
  Agreed, there are Dioceses which are traditionally 'low' - ours is one of them - but the principal service at our Cathedral is a Sung Eucharist (with incense on major Festivals). Sung Mattins used to precede it on most Sundays, being held in the Quire (the Eucharist is celebrated in the Nave), but now seems to take place only once a month.
  
  As regards the MW Report, I think this is the first time I've seen one from Chelmsford - one of England's least-known Cathedrals, perhaps? They seem to have done a good job on this occasion, and I would suggest that the place is well worth a visit!
• Pomona Shipmate

  5:27PM edited 5:27PM

  Blackburn Cathedral was the main one I was thinking of, but also Liverpool Cathedral, and somewhat surprisingly my local cathedral in Winchester (the diocese post-Reformation leaning very Evangelical despite the cathedral's historical Catholic importance). Definitely no daily Eucharist and no reservation of the Sacrament in Winchester, a day having only Morning Prayer and Evensong or Compline is common.
  
  Sometimes cathedral practice can be somewhat "lower" than surrounding churches if the diocese is very split along liturgical lines - I don't remember Chichester reserving the Sacrament but @MrsBeaky could possibly correct me there. Certainly when I lived in Chiami (locally we joked about "Chiami and Bogbados [Bognor Regis!]") I was surprised by how MOTR it was but given how dramatically liturgical practice in Chichester diocese varies I can understand it. I think MOTR Anglican cathedral practice is more common than you might think.
• Bishops Finger Shipmate

  5:50PM

  I hardly like to correct you @Pomona, but Winchester is advertising a Eucharist every day this week...so is Liverpool (according to their respective websites).
  
  Blackburn seems to omit the Eucharist on Mondays.
  
  I expect they all reserve the Sacrament, if only for Communion of the Sick - IIRC, our Cathedral has an aumbry near the High Altar, with the customary light, but some places may keep the Sacrament reverently in the sacristy.
  
  
  
  
• Nick Tamen Shipmate

  5:56PM

  Bishops Finger wrote: »

  I hardly like to correct you @Pomona, but Winchester is advertising a Eucharist every day this week...so is Liverpool (according to their respective websites).

  Also, the cathedral’s website says:

  The regular pattern of daily services has been part of this place since monastic times. Each day starts and finishes with Morning and Evening Prayer, as well as Holy Communion every day of the year. . . .
  
  Today, the regular daily pattern of Morning Prayer, Holy Communion and Choral Evensong are the lifeblood of this great Cathedral.

  FWIW.
  
  
  
• Pomona Shipmate

  7:01PM

  It may well be different now - some people may be aware of a highly-publicised Change of Management at Winchester Cathedral a short time ago with a lot of preceding unpleasantness between the director of music and the cathedral chapter etc in the press. So it does make sense that things have become more sacramental given the Changes - certainly I was always surprised that there wasn't always a daily Eucharist when I attended, which was under the previous management.
• MrsBeaky Shipmate

  8:34PM

  @Pomona the reserved sacrament is kept in the Lady Chapel at Chichester Cathedral with a candle burning, I often sit there to pray.
• Bishops Finger Shipmate

  8:56PM

  Bradford Cathedral has two Eucharists on Sunday, but AFAICT normally only one during the week. The Offices are said daily, however.
  
  Again, looking at one or two of their online recordings, Bradford doesn't use full eucharistic vestments, but just alb and stole.
  
  Does anyone know if there are any other cathedrals in England which don't employ chasubles? I know that some also have dalmatics and tunicles, but I'm guessing that these are not necessarily found everywhere.
• angloid Shipmate

  9:52PM edited 9:55PM

  Having a personal interest in Bradford Cathedral (I was ordained there) I checked what liturgical offerings were scheduled for a day when I could visit. I was surprised that, according to the website, the daily offices are not open to the public, but only online. And as you say, only one weekday eucharist.
  
  Liverpool has always been sui generis liturgically. In its early days it was advised by the Blessed Percy Dearmer, but the diocese has long been influenced by the ferociously protestant bishop J C Ryle and so the cathedral has always had to tread gently. Even until recent years the usual vesture for the eucharist was surplice and stole (with copes on Sunday). But now chasubles (with dalmatic and tunicle for assistants) seem to be the rule. The blessed sacrament is reserved and incense is not unknown I believe. There is even a statue of Our Lady of Walsingham.
  
  I think cathedral liturgical practice has become more standardised in a sort of gentle catholic way. Twenty or thirty years ago, many of them would be what you might describe as high-church protestant –very formal services, with copes rather than chasubles, and often a main-service Mattins.