Donald ******* Trump

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  • PigletPiglet All Saints Host, Circus Host
    Out of curiosity, I googled Ms Bondi, as I always thought she looked very young to be in such a senior position. It turns out she's 60 - only a few years younger than me - and at least half as old again as I thought she was.

    I wonder if she's got a portrait in her attic? 🤔

    I also wonder if she'd had a change of mind about releasing the files*, and that's why she got the boot?

    * or if Trump thought she had
  • Files? What files? Surely there are more important things for the Hobgoblin to think about...
  • Jane RJane R Shipmate
    Well, there's the moon mission...
  • SparrowSparrow Shipmate
    Gramps49 wrote: »

    MSN had an article on how a person with no morals uses 13 phrases. I have heard a number of the coming from the Orange One: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/people-with-zero-morals-almost-always-say-13-phrases-when-they-talk/ss-AA1ZF2Tc?ocid

    I can't access that, but I'm guessing that a couple of them are "I'll be honest with you" and "people say ..."
  • sionisaissionisais Shipmate
    In a lighter area we may hear that the directors, eg of a football club, express their full confidence in the manager. It’s usually about a week before the manager gets the boot.
  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    Well, you do have to get behind someone in order to stab them in the back...
  • Nick TamenNick Tamen Shipmate
    Sparrow wrote: »
    Gramps49 wrote: »

    MSN had an article on how a person with no morals uses 13 phrases. I have heard a number of the coming from the Orange One: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/people-with-zero-morals-almost-always-say-13-phrases-when-they-talk/ss-AA1ZF2Tc?ocid

    I can't access that, but I'm guessing that a couple of them are "I'll be honest with you" and "people say ..."
    It’s even more basic—stuff like “I don’t care who gets hurt” or “I’d do it again.” Despite being on a news site, it’s not news. Like I said earlier, it’s clickbait.


  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Nick Tamen wrote: »
    Looks like clickbait to me.

    Yeah, it doesn't exactly frame itself in rigorously scientific terms.

    The majority of people with no morals are masters of pretending to be the nice guy...

    As for the 13 phrases, at least a few of them could be completely justifiable, depending on the situation.

    I had no choice

    The writer tries to rebut this by pointing out that you always have a choice, but I think the phrase in everyday speech is used to mean something like "The other choices were much worse." And it doesn't necessarily imply selfish motivations, either.
  • Very often it means "the other so-called choices were the kind of thing no decent human being would consider for a moment."
  • edited April 3
    Jane R wrote: »
    Well, there's the moon mission...

    I wonder if anyone else here will remember 'they brought back a big back of rocks...only cost 13 billion...must be nice rocks'. Hey, ITTWACW! :-)

    (This trip down memory lane has prompted me to see whether I can find my cassette, and whether it, and the deck, still work - wow, they do, man! OK, it's a Myrrh re-issue from about 1990).
  • KarlLBKarlLB Shipmate
    edited April 3
    Jane R wrote: »
    Well, there's the moon mission...

    I wonder if anyone else here will remember 'they brought back a big back of rocks...only cost 13 billion...must be nice rocks'. Hey, ITTWACW! :-)

    (This trip down memory lane has prompted me to see whether I can find my cassette, and whether it, and the deck, still work - wow, they do, man! OK, it's a Myrrh re-issue from about 1990).

    I was only thinking about Mr Norman yesterday. This Cultural Life on Radio 4 was interviewing war photographer Don McCullin and it was straight out of Six O'clock News

    It was gut wrenching, but worth listening to. The saddest bit was when
    he asked how many lives he'd actually saved by recording man's inhumanity to man - and concluded none. He'd just recorded it. It's still going on just the same

    Well worth finding on BBC Sounds, but be prepared for some difficult listening.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Jane R wrote: »
    Well, there's the moon mission...

    I wonder if anyone else here will remember 'they brought back a big back of rocks...only cost 13 billion...must be nice rocks'. Hey, ITTWACW! :-)

    Those are pretty good lyrics. But I assume I'm not the first listener to notice that the music bears an unseemly resemblance to Subterranean Homesick Blues?
  • I was never much of a Dylan fan, but now I go looking for it - of course you are right. The album is 'only visiting this planet' if you want to see if there are any more rip-offs!
  • Gramps49Gramps49 Shipmate
    The Parable of the Orange in the Burning Orchard**

    There once was an **Orange** who lived in a vast orchard.
    The Orange was proud—round, loud, and convinced he was the brightest fruit on the tree.

    One spring, the orchard caught fire.

    Not because the trees were sick.
    Not because the soil was poor.
    But because the Orange kept **rolling around with torches**, insisting the flames made the orchard “strong.”

    As the fire spread, the Orange shouted to the other fruit:

    > “Do not worry! I will protect you from the flames I definitely did not start!”

    But the orchard workers—the Apples, the Plums, the Berries—noticed something strange.

    The Orange had no money left for the things the orchard actually needed.**

    - No money for **Medicaid**, so the sick fruit shriveled.
    - No money for **Medicare**, so the older fruit cracked and dried.
    - No money for **child care**, so the seedlings wilted in the heat.

    Every time the workers asked why, the Orange pointed at the fire and said:

    > “We must spend everything fighting this blaze!
    > And if we run out, the *states* should pay.
    > Some orchards are rich, others poor—
    > but that’s not my problem.”

    The rich orchards built tall stone wells to protect their fruit.
    The poor orchards dug with their bare hands and prayed for rain.

    Meanwhile, the Orange kept rolling through the flames, shouting:

    > “Look how brave I am! Look how strong I am!
    > Ignore the burning. Ignore the coughing.
    > Ignore the orchard workers collapsing in the smoke.”

    Eventually, the fire reached the Orange.**

    Not because the Orange was targeted.
    Not because the Orange was unlucky.
    But because **fire does not care who started it**.

    And as the Orange began to blister, he cried out:

    > “Why can’t anyone save me?
    > Why can’t anyone afford to help?”

    The Apples and Plums and Berries answered:

    > “Because we spent everything on your fires.
    > And you told us the states should handle the rest.”

    The Orange tried to roll away, but the orchard was ash.
    The wells were empty.
    The seedlings were gone.

    And the workers whispered to one another:

    > “A fruit that burns its own orchard
    > should not be surprised
    > when there is no shade left

    https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-says-not-possible-us-pay-medicaid-medicare-daycare-re-fighting-w-rcna266381
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    I was never much of a Dylan fan, but now I go looking for it - of course you are right. The album is 'only visiting this planet' if you want to see if there are any more rip-offs!

    Thanks for confirming. I will say that Norman does a more economical job of matching up his lyrics with discernable cultural events and news-topics of the era, whereas Dylan, at least in SHB, uses synechdoches that vaguely point to whatever social deficiencies the listener wishes to imagine.

    (Dylan's method does get you more intriguing imagery, as opposed to Norman just delivering a series of rapid-fire insults.)
  • An interesting comment (5 minute video) from Paul Krugman, who believes that something may be about to happen:

    https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/donald-trump-isnt-sounding-like-himself?utm_source=podcast-email&publication_id=277517&post_id=193185597&utm
  • Interesting, and scary (as Mr Krugman says).

    Is the Foul Fiend losing the last of his mind, and will he unleash his nukes? Glory be to God, indeed...
    :scream:
  • Should note that Dr Krugman was awarded a Nobel Prize (for economic theory). Trump is still expecting his prize to recognise his personal achievement of peace in the middle east.
  • Is he?

    Well, I don't think there will be peace in the Middle East this side of the eschaton but he should be credited with reducing the threat of nuclear war for western countries and proxy warfare in the Middle East.
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    Does the late ayatollah also deserve the same credit for his fatwa against the use of nuclear weapons ?
  • DafydDafyd Hell Host
    edited April 5
    Well, I don't think there will be peace in the Middle East this side of the eschaton but he should be credited with reducing the threat of nuclear war for western countries and proxy warfare in the Middle East.
    Credible military strategists (*) think Trump's actions are increasing the threat of nuclear war and proxy warfare in the medium to long term.

    (*) That is, ones who doubted decapitating the Iranian regime would lead to its immediate collapse, and who knew that the Iranian regime's first reaction would be to close the Strait of Hormuz.
  • LouiseLouise Epiphanies Host
    I think it's missing the point to argue what Basil Fawlty would call 'the bleeding obvious' with Trump supporters after he just showed incontrovertibly what an ignoramus and disaster he is in geostrategic and military terms. They know he fucked up colossally- and even Trump himself seems to realise that.

    But as long as he keeps delivering the racism and male white supremacy, supporters of that will continue to be happy with him.

    That's what they support him for - and he's delivering on it. So they're fine with it and will make up whatever nonsense they think might cover his arse on other topics.
  • RuthRuth Shipmate
    Well, I don't think there will be peace in the Middle East this side of the eschaton but he should be credited with reducing the threat of nuclear war for western countries and proxy warfare in the Middle East.

    Bullshit. Iran will want nuclear weapons even more because of all this.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    From the BBC website, quoting Trump on Truth Social
    The paragraph below contains very strong language.

    Trump says: "Tuesday will be Power Plant Day, and Bridge Day, all wrapped up in one, in Iran. There will be nothing like it!!! Open the Fuckin’ Strait, you crazy bastards, or you’ll be living in Hell - JUST WATCH! Praise be to Allah. President DONALD J. TRUMP"

    Utterly appalling. Surely he must realise that there is no way Iran will respond by surrender? He must actually want to unleash that bombing?

    I wonder what the Christians and Christian Right leaders who support him will make of this outrageous message?
  • Wow, Trump is showing the strain. He likes easy victories, so for another country to resist is unpardonable. Why do bullies get elected?
  • Bishops FingerBishops Finger Shipmate
    edited April 5
    From today's UK Guardian live blog:

    Former Trump ally Majorie Taylor Greene has said everyone in the Trump administration who claims to be a Christian needs to “beg forgiveness from God” and intervene in the president’s “madness”.

    She goes on to describe Trump as 'insane', which is not so far off the truth.
  • It struck me that Trump uses word magic. Thus, the use of capitals, expletives, and intensive words, "big, beautiful", show this. Here's a free bit of psychoanalysis, it shows that he feels weak and humiliated. It reminds me of Hitler's long bombastic speeches. Oops, is that a Godwin.
  • LouiseLouise Epiphanies Host
    Godwin himself stated "Yes, it's okay to compare Trump to Hitler. Don't let me stop you."
  • The psychology of humiliation is interesting, and one thing that strikes me is that the person dare not have the feeling. It has to be projected onto others, thus the bully tries to humiliate you, then he temporarily feels free of it. But, damn, it comes back. Hitler employed mass humiliation, e.g., getting people to clean the streets, etc. Apologies for tangent.
  • TurquoiseTasticTurquoiseTastic Kerygmania Host
    edited April 5
    From today's UK Guardian live blog:

    Former Trump ally Majorie Taylor Greene has said everyone in the Trump administration who claims to be a Christian needs to “beg forgiveness from God” and intervene in the president’s “madness”.

    She goes on to describe Trump as 'insane', which is not so far off the truth.

    It is coming to something when MTG is the voice of reason. I have to say there's not much to disagree with in that Guardian blog quote.
  • TurquoiseTasticTurquoiseTastic Kerygmania Host
    And in fact that whole Twitter post is bang on target: ".... stop worshipping the President"... "Our President is not a Christian and his words and actions should not be supported by Christians".... "Jesus commanded us to love one another .... even our enemies"

    Credit where credit is due....
  • HillelHillel Shipmate
    Barnabas62 wrote: »
    From the BBC website, quoting Trump on Truth Social
    The paragraph below contains very strong language.

    Trump says: "Tuesday will be Power Plant Day, and Bridge Day, all wrapped up in one, in Iran. There will be nothing like it!!! Open the Fuckin’ Strait, you crazy bastards, or you’ll be living in Hell - JUST WATCH! Praise be to Allah. President DONALD J. TRUMP"

    Utterly appalling. Surely he must realise that there is no way Iran will respond by surrender? He must actually want to unleash that bombing?

    I wonder what the Christians and Christian Right leaders who support him will make of this outrageous message?

    He made the same mistake that Putin did regarding Ukraine. He thought he could achieve a quick, easy victory and badly underestimated his opponents in the process. This latest outburst is one part fury that people have the nerve to defy him like this, and one part fear that he's got himself and the USA into something that isn't going to easy to get out of.
  • BoogieBoogie Heaven Host
    What will the sane generals in the US military make of this message?

    Isn't it time they stood up and said 'no'.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    MTG hit the nail on the head. I think she’s had a conversion experience.
  • Boogie wrote: »
    What will the sane generals in the US military make of this message?

    Isn't it time they stood up and said 'no'.

    Many of the sane generals have already been sacked. Those that haven't are probably keeping their heads down, knowing that when this shit show is finally over there will be a desperate need for decent senior officers to sort out the mess.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    Barnabas62 wrote: »
    MTG hit the nail on the head. I think she’s had a conversion experience.

    I think she's always been an isolationist and opposed to a pro-Israeli orientation in mideast policy. It's just that Trump has now swung dramatically toward a neo-con position, and unlike most of his cultists, she's unwilling to abandon her principles to support him.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    But no longer a cultist? Seems like it.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    edited April 5
    Barnabas62 wrote: »
    But no longer a cultist? Seems like it.

    Based on observing her trajectory, I'm guessing she was never a full cultist to begin with, in the sense of someone who believes whatever Trump tells them to believe just because Trump was the one telling them to believe that.

    I think she either a) started off with a set of ideas that she later saw articulated by Trump so decided to join his movement, or b) was convinced to believe that set of ideas by Trump, but eventually came to believe them as virtues in and of themselves, and wasn't prepared to follow him in his departure from them.

    I doubt you will see MTG announcing her love for her enemies in regards to trans people and migrants, since AFAIK she still holds to MAGA's hostility toward those groups. Not that that makes me less appreciative of her stances on Gaza and Iran.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    Oh I agree re trans and migrants. She’s never going to be liberal.
  • I see that the mad Hobgoblin's latest obscene effusion invokes the name of Allah...

    :flushed:

  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    I think he moved close to fatwa territory.
  • PigletPiglet All Saints Host, Circus Host
    Barnabas62 wrote: »
    From the BBC website, quoting Trump on Truth Social
    The paragraph below contains very strong language.

    Trump says: "Tuesday will be Power Plant Day, and Bridge Day, all wrapped up in one, in Iran. There will be nothing like it!!! Open the Fuckin’ Strait, you crazy bastards, or you’ll be living in Hell - JUST WATCH! Praise be to Allah. President DONALD J. TRUMP"

    Utterly appalling. Surely he must realise that there is no way Iran will respond by surrender? He must actually want to unleash that bombing?

    I wonder what the Christians and Christian Right leaders who support him will make of this outrageous message?

    I wondered if the post was genuinely written by him: does he usually swear in print? And the "praise to Allah" just seems bizarre, unless it's his twisted idea of a joke.
  • Barnabas62Barnabas62 Shipmate, Host Emeritus
    Piglet

    It’s certainly twisted. But then I’m pretty sure he is.
  • If it isn't genuine, surely it would have been deleted/corrected by now?

    I guess it's hard to accept that the President of the United States is a madman, bent on dealing out death and destruction to innocent people.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    edited April 5
    Has anyone considered that Trump mighta thrown that bit about Allah in as an attempt(credible or otherwise) to rally whatever segments of the Muslim(likely Sunni) world that he thinks might be sympathetic to his anti-Iranian cause?

    Plus, as someone was mentioning here or somewhere else, "Allah" is used by Arab-speaking Christians as well, at least some of whom, eg. Arabs among the Christian Zionists are plausible allies. But I think the more strategic consideration right now might be whatever sections of public opinion in the Islamic world.
  • HedgehogHedgehog Shipmate
    I suspect that most of us think that "strategic consideration" and "Trump" are too separate worlds that never intersect.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    edited April 6
    Hedgehog wrote: »
    I suspect that most of us think that "strategic consideration" and "Trump" are too separate worlds that never intersect.

    I think he's hit-or-miss on that, and while the misses can be dramatic(eg. thinking people in Greenland would just automatically rally to his offer of whateverhood), I don't think we can really ignore the hits, either. He did, for example, manage to extract the president of a large Latin American country for trial in NYC, while seemingly maintaining at least cordial relations with that man's still-ruling political party in the aftermath. Examples also available from domestic politics.

    In his current galaxy of advisers, I could maybe see Tulsi Gabbard as someone who'd suggest an outreach to Muslims, assuming she's now pro-aggression in regards to Iran.
  • DoublethinkDoublethink Admin, 8th Day Host
    Please would you all read Styx.
  • stetsonstetson Shipmate
    edited April 6
    Please would you all read Styx.

    Sorry. What is it that you want us to read in Styx?
  • North East QuineNorth East Quine Purgatory Host
    stetson wrote: »
    Please would you all read Styx.

    Sorry. What is it that you want us to read in Styx?

    Recent plankings.
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